When we started this blog, back in 2016, we had been naturists for several years but had never heard of a thing called “the single men issue in naturism”. Only when we entered the online naturist world we suddenly got overwhelmed by this phenomenon. What single men issue? What gender imbalance? We had never experienced any of this in the naturist places we had visited before. Not that we counted the number of men and women, but it always seemed pretty balanced to us.
The more we read about this, the more horror stories came up. From several different angles. Women feeling insecure at nude beaches. Men being approached by other men with indecent proposals. But also stories about pure discrimination, single men not being allowed at naturist places just because they didn’t have a female companion. One of the most striking stories was about a long time naturist couple of which the woman passed away. Suddenly the widower was not welcome anymore at his favorite naturist spots.
The difficulty in forming an opinion
We have been musing a lot about this subject and wrote several blog post drafts that never made it online. Somehow we thought that we had to take a stand in this. That we had to tell you who we think is right and who isn’t. But we can’t. After talking about this with women, men, couples and resort owners, we noticed that this isn’t just one issue. It’s a bunch of issues all being more or less related to each other.
When looking through the eyes of the single male naturist, the story couldn’t be any sadder. Gender discrimination typically is something from a century ago and lots of people had very long struggles to get rid of this. And then it pops up in 21st-century naturism, a lifestyle in which equality is being promoted as one of its highest values.
I’ll show you mine…
Talking with couples gave us a whole other story, which relates to the beginnings of naturism. Before clothing-optional became a thing, most naturist places where nude obligatory. Some of them even enforce these rules until today. It’s all about vulnerability. Here we are, completely naked, there’s no way that we can hide our flaws and insecurities. In order to keep the balance, we expect you to do the same thing. If you are allowed to wear clothes, we will feel naked instead of nude.
This also reflects on relationships. If I allow you to see my partner nude, I should be allowed to see your partner nude as well. Show me yours and I’ll show you mine. It’s definitely not a mentality we stand behind, but it does occur pretty often. It’s being said that there’s no place for jealousy within naturism, but jealousy isn’t something you can just turn off when you undress. You can definitely work on it, but this takes a lot of time. So if you don’t have a partner and I do, the balance feels disturbed.
Running a naturist business
Also for us, it has taken quite some time to become used to being naked among the clothed or to be nude as a couple in a gender imbalanced setting. Today, we would say that we got over this completely. That we feel 100% comfortable being the only couple in a male-dominated naturist setting. But even that comes with a sidenote. If we would visit a naturist resort and end up being the only couple, we would not run away or even feel awkward. But if the resort next door does have a gender balance, we’ll probably visit that one the next time.
Does that make us hypocrites? On one hand, we’re raving about the open mindset of naturists and how everyone is treated equally, but on the other hand, we would also prefer a resort with enforced gender-equality. Knowing that maybe the person from the introduction who had just lost his wife would not be allowed in there. We rather believe that it makes us human. In the end, the principles of naturism are an ideology. Something we strive to, but can’t always reach.
Of course, naturist businesses understand this as well. Their goal is to make money and to run a business of which they can be proud. What would happen if there was a sudden gender-imbalance? Would the remaining couples keep coming or move towards the resort next door? Would the resort suddenly become men-only? Will the single men keep coming to a men-only resort?
What’s wrong with men-only?
Although we strongly regret the discrimination of single men, now and then we also see their dark side. The other day we got into an online discussion about a person not being allowed at a naturist resort for being a single man. We talked about the discrimination, about how “real” naturists should not make a difference in whether someone happens to be male or female and happens to have a partner or not. About how quota on singles is completely against the philosophy of naturism. We completely get that, but it’s not something we can change. So we proposed that the person would visit a men-only resort.
He didn’t want to do that. Because there wouldn’t be any women. We don’t doubt the genuineness of this person and we’re pretty sure that he wasn’t a gawker or exhibitionist. But apparently, also for single men, gender balance can be important. This makes the whole situation extremely complicated of course. If couples prefer mixed-gender places, and singles prefer mixed-gender places, the only solution would be an equal amount of single naturist men and single naturist women. Which is, unfortunately, not likely to happen any time soon.
The fear of the single nude man
One of the biggest problems within the single male naturist issue is that the large majority of cases of misbehavior happen to be caused by single men. There’s no denying in this. Those who frequent nude beaches will definitely agree. How many times has it happened that a woman was staring at you from the dunes? How many times did a single naturist woman get too close to you on the nude beach? Trying to block your view with her genitals? We’re not saying that those cases don’t happen. But the statistics will prove us right.
The very sad thing about this is that people started to link misbehavior with single men. We’ve just said it ourselves. Look at the stats! We bet that 80% of all cases are caused by single men. Add another 15% couples trying to get something going with an audience and maybe 5% women acting inappropriately. So it would be very easy to conclude that if we take away the single men, the nude beach would be 80% more agreeable.
The truth behind these stats is, however, that they create a completely wrong image. Imagine a popular nude beach on a nice sunny day. There are about 500 visitors. Let’s create a bit of gender-imbalance and say that there are 150 couples, 150 single men and 50 single women. How many of those single men will misbehave? 2? 3? Even if it’s a bit of a dodgy beach, there will probably not be more than 15. That’s 10%. 15 dirty minds making 135 genuine naturists look bad.
The solution to the single male naturist issue
It’s clear that the single male naturist has an image problem and the previous paragraph also makes it clear that this is largely unfair. Yet it’s there. Private naturist places like resorts often take the easy road and set up a quotum. Not more than 60% of the visitors should be male at any given moment. Some resorts even aim for a 50-50 balance. This does solve their problem but makes the problem of the single male naturist even worse. Because it sends out the message that there’s actually something wrong with singles in naturism.
Someone pointed out a very interesting angle on this the other day. What if the genuine single male naturists would start taking care of the security at the nude beach? In the case of our previously mentioned dodgy beach, that would mean 135 naturists who could walk over to those 15 perverts to tell them to behave. The nude beach will suddenly feel much less sexually attractive to them if they see such a bunch of angry nude men coming their way. Even if you’re just by yourself, most gawkers will run off before you ever manage to reach them.
This is a theory which we really support because it could actually solve the whole image problem. Not only will the beach be more secure, but the other visitors will also be happy with the single men around. This might even make for more couples and single women feeling comfortable around single men. But it will never completely solve the gender-imbalance problem. For this, the only solution will be to get more single women into naturism. How we’ll accomplish that is something we still have to muse about.
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94 thoughts on “Musings about Single Men in Naturism”
Thank you. Well written. As a single male naturist, I appreciate the thought put into this. So far, the only naturist establishment in my area is a gay resort that welcomes women too, and so there’s been no problem with single male discrimination. But I have observed that the mixed couples there tend to not interact with the single male, while the gay male or female couples have no such inhibition.
I agree, this was a very well written and thoughtful article on a subject that will affect many readers. Thanks Nick and Lins! I think you are right on all points.
For me personally, I don’t mind that my social interactions with other naturists are generally limited to other single men. I go to my local beaches foremost for the sun and the sea, though I have met many great people there. The only problem is having to occasionally, gently, lower the expectations of those who are looking for more than just a chat!
The situation with private resorts is certainly disappointing, but I cannot see it changing.
Several comments on this excellent article.
I have been a ‘single’ naturist for close on 40 years, and have often witnessed on naturist or clothing optional beaches the voyeurs/peeping toms, usually male and usually older. However I have found these voyeurs to be increasingly rare.
On my local nude beach near Montpellier, many single or groups of women hang out In the so called gay section as they often feel less vulnerable surrounded by gay men.
When my local naturist camp closed down 4 years ago, many of us moved onto CHM Montalivet. However I had to be sponsored for my first year as a single man, despite having worked at and later visited regularly my previous resort over 30 years. I didn’t mind this as CHM Is a family orientated resort and all members are equally protective of keeping an eye out for misdemeanours mainly on the beach but sometimes in the resort. However one part of this sponsor rule is that 2 new men booking together or a new group of men booking together do not have to be sponsored. I have witnessed often groups of blokes never being naked in the commercial centre even in very warm temperatures and have even seen some not being naked in the open showers or not being naked on the beach ( often by using the unguarded passage ways from the extremities of the beach to the resort). This is one side of the single rule that is openly discriminatory to true new single naturists who may not know of anyone in the resort who can sponsor them.
A dilemma for the resorts I must admit and perhaps by only having a team of naturist ambassadors employed by the resort who interact with the resort clients regularly can this be improved. There is a proviso on this as at CHM they no longer use ambassadors but just security as the ambassadors were increasingly insulted by clothed guests when politely asked why they were clothed in shorts t shirts hoodies etc. In warm temperatures. All guests at CHM have to sign a naturist contract but it is not enforced except when go7 g to the beach by the guarded passageways. This is a far bigger problem I feel to naturist resorts than controlling single men, at the increasing textualisation of naturist resorts.
Hi, thanks for your comment!
We didn’t know that you had to be sponsored at CHM. But that’s possible at one of the resort’s naturist clubs, right? Not for the actual resort. Because we do know that CHM has quite a large security staff to keep an eye on things.
The increasing number of textiles at naturist resorts is (we think) an evolutionary thing. Never before have there been so many people in the world who like to spend some of their time in the nude. But that doesn’t mean all their time. We notice that there are lots of people today who discovered the joys of nude sunbathing and swimming but don’t feel much for shopping or dining in the nude. In the past this didn’t really exist, then it was all or nothing.
We also believe that eventually, this increasing number will be good for naturism in a way that it will become more socially accepted. But we are indeed moving towards a more clothing-optional scene. There will always be clubs that will keep nudity obligatory at all times though.
I noticed a lot of clubs now (in the US) only require nudity in the pool, sauna., beach area. But on the trails, and your own campsite, you maybe dress. A solution for “The creepy male fear” should be simple, have everyone – no matter the gender – sign a form that they acknowledge the rules (most clubs have the same rules), and say breaking these rules would be cause for automatic disable from the premise, and if need be contacting the authorities. Also, making copies of all visitors’ most up-to-date ID, with their current address.
I read your article. I agree , As a single man and a nudist this is a complex issue. I am not gay yet I do receive many advances from gay men that I’m not comfortable with at beaches. My solution was a swingers club. As a single male nudist they allow me to use the pool and sunbathe without issue. Yet don’t tolerate misbehavior on the part of other single men. I have met great people. I just wish the pool was bigger for swimming, swingers like to drink n party!!
Hi, why move immediately from the nude beach to the swingers resort? Naturist resorts also have security and protect their guests from indecent behavior
Because even as a Male who grew up as a nudist from the age of 5. The resort I grew up socializing at as a child is a family only resort. No single males are admitted. So if I wanted to swim I would either need a female as a couple or join the local swingers resort. I didn’t know what to expect at first, but in reality during the week the pool is empty and the swingers are very polite and understanding, they keep their sexual exploits discrete, and are very accepting to those of us nudists who just want to swim and sit in the sun. I usually swim a mile and rest in the sun. I wish the local nudist resorts were more accepting but I understand their concerns. Thanks for the question. Hopefully I answered.
Definitely, that explains a lot!
It is indeed very sad that nudists are pretty much forced to go to swingers places because the local nudist resorts don’t allow them. There’s quite a structural problem here.
That is horrible that the resort you grew up in won’t let you in just because now you are a single male. I am assuming you are in America? Maybe there should be some sort of standard that if a family resort still wants to be part of the AANR, they can’t discriminate against AANR members, even if they are single men. If they do, they lose AANR accreditation.
While I agree that single male perverts are a cause for concern, allowing the discrimination against all single nudists is still outright wrong. And deferring everyone’s’ security duties to the single male is also just another form of elitism for couples and women to download their problems and fears onto the single man.
Time to deal with the perverts, not the whole demographic. Profiling by gender is just as wrong as profiling based on race. Bigotry has no place in “family friendly environments”.
Unfortunately, we have evolved to a time in which fewer and fewer people want to take responsibility. At some nude beaches around the world, we did still find a local naturist club taking care of the beaches and scaring away perverts. But in Europe, for example, with its abundance of nude beaches and lack of volunteers, this has become almost impossible. So it’s up to the visitors to keep the beach secure. But few wish to put their energy in it. We’ve heard many people complain about perverts at certain beaches, yet very few of them actually took action against it…
With this blog post, we don’t want to promote elitism for couples or women. We just say things as we see them and try to search for solutions.
I have been reading about and commenting on this issue for a while, and the closest thing to a solution was the Femme Fwd model, used by an organization in NYC, where men would need an unsolicited sponsor or attend an all male nude event first before they could attend any other mixed gender event.
I also have been posing the question if nudist just want to socialize nude, then why the big push for female attendance?
Can you only have a good time if there “X” number of women there? And if women are so fearful of the male gaze why aren’t there more female only events?
What I really find offensive about the attempt at gender balancing is that if single males are allowed at an event they are charged 3-4x more than a single female which to me says that you really don’t want me there.
You could put it that way.
On the other hand, if a price differential results in a better balance, that’s good for those in attendance. And it may be the least onerous approach to the problem.
Maybe a “single male surcharge” could be dedicated to charity.
We’re definitely not fans of charging higher rates for single men, especially if they aren’t charged for single women. Yet it’s a practice you’ll also see a lot outside of the naturist world. “Girls night” is very commonly used in bars all over the world, where women can enter for free and/or get free drinks while men have to pay.
Your idea to dedicate the male surcharge is definitely a step forward, and if we really want to solve the problem, we could even dedicate the surcharge to projects which encourage female naturism.
Problem is if the “ratio problem” is solved will the surcharge be dropped? No, revenue streams like that never go away. The real solution is for everyone to treat everyone equally. and toss the trouble makers regardless of their sex or orientation.
We’re pretty sure that the surcharge would drop if the ratio issue is solved. That’s free market. Take away the demand and the supply will adjust.
The ratio problem will not go away or stay away on its own.
If a single male surcharge works, it should stay in place. Drop it, the the ratio will revert to what it was.
Charging singles more than couples is rather a business thing, we believe, and not meant to scare away singles. When the demand is higher than the supply, people start seeing opportunities.
The “sponsoring” idea seems to work pretty well, but we’re also sure that it can be overwhelming for beginning nudists.
I know the place you are talking about “Just Naked”, stay away. They are HORRIBLE! They don’t share any naturist values. They simply want to make a place just for people to hang out naked. And because of that they got creeps and had to do the whole sponsor bullshit. How about explaining what naturist is on your website (I don’t think they use the word “naturist” at all), explain the simple rules and etquests. Use the words “family-friendly”, and have people sign a form with the rules, stating if you don’t follow the cops will be called. It’s that simple. The thing about the “creepy man”, if you talk to club owners, who run clubs that state that they are “family-friendly” and don’t discriminate, the owners would tell you they probably have one issue every few years. Unlike places, who fall into the fear game.
Most people are smart enough to understand the behavior of a handful of single men does not reflect on the rest of them.
The problem is fundamentally the ratio.
It’s easy to survey a nude beach & say “There are too many men here.” Then the “solution” is to try to keep them away.
On the other hand, someone can say “There aren’t enough women here.” Then, getting more women to the beach is definitely a better solution.
I have been following the comments on this blog because this is an issue that I am quite close to. I agree with Glenn that this is a form of elitism / discrimination, by the establishments that we uphold to protect our rights as nudists. I also think the issue is deeper with the gender matching at nudist events. Simply placed we as nudists have failed our mission statement in many ways. The nudist group has agreed that nudism is sexuality. Sexuality has capitol, capitol dictates policy. And as men we don’t capitalize our nudity. It has zero value socially. And because men are the root of all thats bad in western culture they have no value, its easy to discriminate. I am lucky for where I live, and I am glad I can think for myself. Sadly I wish my nudist brothers n sisters could do the same. Nudism is comfort , confidence in yourself and an expression of honesty and acceptance. And as a side note, Swingers seem very accepting to those of us single guys who are comfortable nude.
Let me offer a different perspective for your consideration. In practically any public gathering, nude or textile, you will find some creepy, or otherwise undesirable, people, who are almost always guys, who can be very annoying, but are almost always harmless. I believe they are a very small minority of the people you find at places such as clothing optional beaches and they aren’t the single males I want to discuss here. Please bear in mind this is not directed at anyone in particular.
Once you eliminate the creepy guys acting stupid, you’re left with harmless naked guys, with no intention of bothering anyone. If they make you uncomfortable, then there’s something wrong with you. That actually means you are a bigot.
How can someone, who is doing absolutely nothing to directly affect you, make you feel uncomfortable? You are just choosing to be uncomfortable. Get over it. It’s all in your mind. You are probably imagining a potential and unrealistic threat to your safety.
If you were in the same situation, but with everyone wearing clothes, would you feel the same discomfort? If not, why not? The solution to the single male problem requires only an attitude adjustment. But that’s unlikely to happen.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this Bill! This is actually something we’ve mentioned in other blog posts before. The fact that some nudists have all kinds of alarms going off in their heads as soon as they see a single man, has often nothing to do with that man. It’s mostly a combination of insecurities, horror stories, and possible previous negative experiences.
But you can’t force a person to feel 100% comfortable. You can’t choose to feel 100% comfortable. So the trick is in finding a middle way. That’s a bit what this blog post is about. If the nudists make an effort to not see every single as a potential threat and the singles make an effort in improving their image, the nude world could become a little bit better.
If you say that you can’t choose to feel 100% comfortable, you must be saying that someone else has control of your mind, and that’s ridiculous.
If you determine that the others, over whom you have no control, must do something in order to solve your problem, it’s never going to be solved, but if changing your attitude makes the problem go away, then that is clearly what you should do. Complaining accomplishes little, if anything.
We don’t say that this is the right way, but that’s a lot about how our society seems to work. We don’t feel comfortable and blame others for that.
In Europe, there’s currently a huge uprise of rightwing political parties. People feel uncomfortable with other people who have different backgrounds, religions and cultures. And they want something else (politics) to solve this problem for them. Even those who never had a negative experience with a foreigner, are afraid of them.
It’s very hard to admit that something is just in your mind. Because then it’s up to you to make a change. It’s unfortunately much easier to blame others.
It is difficult to admit something is all in your mind only if you make it so. And blaming others is easy, but it accomplishes nothing.
“If you say that you can’t choose to feel 100% comfortable, you must be saying that someone else has control of your mind, and that’s ridiculous”
Don’t agree with that Bill. People can’t just ‘choose’ to feel 100% comfortable in many situations, be it on a nude beach or event, a presentation where they have to give a speech, a job interview or any number of other scenarios. There’s different levels of ‘comfortableness’ that I have in many situations but that doesn’t mean that when I’m not entirely confident about something ‘someone else has control over my mind’?!! Where do you get that idea from..?!
We had a similar discussion the other day with a friend when we were talking about nude selfies/pictures. If someone shares a nude picture of you, this is not your fault. You didn’t do anything wrong. You are the victim. Nevertheless, this can make you feel extremely uncomfortable. In this case, it even ends up in suicide now and then. Why do we let others make us feel uncomfortable when we didn’t do anything wrong?
This is a bit what Bill means. We let others control our minds. And the more important question is of course: “How can we become strong enough so this wouldn’t happen?”
single men are welcome for their money, e.g. 3 days stay. Then they are molested by the management to make them leave after 1 day, without refund. Noodles don’t know equal rights . Women tend to abuse priviledges. Solution? Right next to Noodles campsite an office with Rent-an-Escort. Day time job for red light district social workeresses. Everyone’s gain.
I am one of the dreaded elderly solo male naturists, and I have met some initial pushback just for being who I am. I anticipated this (lots of reading before ‘going out’) and joined the Federation of Canadian Naturists and also The Naturist Society. Those membership cards allowed me acceptance at three otherwise ‘nervous’ commercial places (two in the USA, one in Spain). I am also upfront about those memberships. I doubt the creepy gawkers would invest that money for the ‘privilege’ of being a nuisance. On the other hand, it is time we learned to get over our prejudices and learn to BE equal, not just claim so to be.
Becoming a member of a federation is a tip we’ve given in a previous blog post about male naturism because it actually increases the chances of being allowed at naturist resorts. But also then we’ve received quite some negative comments about this. “Why should single men pay for memberships while single women and couples can just walk in and out as they wish”.
As mentioned in this blog post, we definitely don’t agree with discrimination, but things are as they are. We could have ended this post saying that it’s time that everyone would get over their prejudices, but we don’t think that this would have much added value.
Tell that to Rosa Parks, if we continue to just accept bigotry it will never be overcome.
My wife and I enjoyed nude recreation and going to Hidden Beach Resort in Mexico, we were members of T N S.
My wife of 40 years died of cancer last year. Now I’m wondering what my options are until I’m part of a couple again. I live in the US.
We hope this turns out well for you!
I am a single (divorced ) nudist and agree it is a complicated issue. I hate being stereotyped as either gay or a perv. I am neither. I also despise being discriminated against by clubs or resorts. I believe “clothing optional” is the core of the problem. If everyone had to be nude, you would eliminate 90% of the creepers. The remaining creepers could be easily identified
by inapproriate behavior and more than likely called out if necessary. That may be the only way to overcome the stigma of the single male nudist. The obstacle is how do you enforce mandatory nude, especially in public “nude” beaches like Gunnison, Haulover or Hippie Hollow?
Isn’t this moving the problem to someone else? Enforcing nudity might decrease the single men issue but will then form an issue for people who like to take things slow, mixed nudist/textile couples and nudists who want to take their textile friends to the beach.
And we don’t think that this could be a solution either. The majority of cases of bad behavior we’ve personally seen happened by naked people.
That’s the wrong approach to take in my view. It’s far more sensible to have a clothes optional policy in most areas except for instance a pool or sunbathing area within a club. Enforcing nudity across the board is too prescriptive and is going to make some people uncomfortable, especially when its a bit chilly and it makes sense to wear clothes – do the always nude rules still apply then?
From our experience, we learned that both nude obligatory and clothing-optional have their advantages and disadvantages. Personally, we also support clothing-optional because it gives naturism more chances to grow. We can take our textile friends to a clothing-optional resort where everyone can be happy in their choice of (un)dress. And there’s always a chance that one of our friends will try naturism as well eventually. While we can’t take them to nude obligatory places unless we’re able to convince them to try naturism upfront. Which limits the chance that they’ll ever get in close contact with naturism/naturists and notice the benefits of it.
When this topic comes up (and it does, repeatedly) I try to say that when we’re at a naturist place, we men should make it our duty to socialize with each other, and not chase after the few women. Are you not a pleasant and friendly person, who’d be a pleasure to meet? Well, most naturist venues (unless they exclude single men) are full of guys just as charming as you. They’d probably be glad for a chat with someone as nice as themselves.
I’ve started calling this concept the “bachelor herd”. I really do think it’s what we should be doing–mixing with others like ourselves. And before anyone wonders, I’m heterosexual, and married. But for naturist purposes, I’m a single guy. And yes, I have practiced what I preach, and I regularly continue to do it. I’ve got my naturist pals, and we’re happy to spend time together. Would I prefer it if there were more women? I suppose I would, though it’s fair to say I’ve come to terms with the situation. And it’s actually reassuring to our stay-at-home wives if we can tell them there are hardly any women in the places we go to!
Here’s an interesting idea: Why do most men have no issue with going to a bar where there are no women and where they only interact with other men, but when they go to a naturist resort, they’d like to have more women there and interact with them?
Stuff to think about…
We do like your proposal though!
The bar, doesn’t have admittance ratios that would deny me access, I go to a nudist park/beach to be nude enjoy the sun and breezes, I don’t really care about the ratio, other than it can be used to deny me access based on my gender. I’m not there to get hit on either.
I don’t want to bothered by gay men. subject: men-only-noodles.
I’m not interested in being part of a herd, bachelor or otherwise, I just want to go to the nudist park and be nude in the sun and breeze, I don’t want to worry about anyone else’s hangups or to be discriminated against because of my gender or marital status. It isn’t my duty to not be discriminated against.
I’m a straight , married man who loves the beach and being naked but my wife does not so I go on my own. So that makes me one of those 80% but does not worry me at all as I always keep my self to my self as do the majority of men do . I’m always respectful to others man or woman ,people do look at others men or women it’s only natural and sometime you can not help but look . I have a body image problem (I have the perfect body for radio) going to a nudist beach tells me I am what I am. There will always be misbehaving at beaches weather it’s gays or couples but I think it getting less and less because people don’t put up with it and let it spoil there day. Live and let live .
Roll on summer.
Well what can I say? We run a nudist retreat (Twin Falls Naturist Retreat ) and we do have single males / females (and unattached / attached !) visiting our retreat. We have a simple policy and that is we expect all our visitors to comply with our rules and that is very simple – we welcome all genuine nudist / naturists. If you are not part of that realm then you need to be somewhere else… (some people apparently just cannot conceive this…)
Another problem being a single Male in the U.S. is the price of admission. We get charged 4 to 5 times the price of single women. It even cost more for us men than it does a couple to get in. It’s not fair but there’s nothing we can do about it.
Male’s charge = female x >1? Don’t spoil your day with getting abused, keep your money where it belongs.
Does seem unfair for the sgl men we have spent a good bit of time at haulover beach and only once did we see any trouble there was a guy who was sitting right near me and my wife and next to us was a couple younger ladies all nude. the guy was not just staring but doing things that was sexual. we kept any eye on him and thge police guard finally made him leave. what is funny me and the wife were on a trans atlantic cruise and ncl was letting the upper deck be used for nude sunbathing so we spent 13 days up there and the funnier part was that there was 14 gay guys up there most of the week and we had some great conversations. they all joked about us being the only straight couple up there but my wife and me were very comfortable even thiou there was only one other straight couple up there the whole week and a few straight sgl guys.
The gay straight thing is also a huge issue in the nudist community. As a straight lifelong nudist who lives a clean life and doesn’t imbibe in alcohol or drugs, I look very young for my age. I truly dislike as a single male nudist getting lumped in as a gay guy at various nudist events. Not only is it offensive, but it doesn’t take into account meeting a woman who is also a nudist and is single. Am I a bad predatory guy if I choose to rather strike up a conversation with a female nudist, rather than talk to a bunch of dudes. Frankly it does look gay if all the single men are in one group as a segregated group so the other nudists as couples feel comfortable. How about spotting the idiots and weeding them out. Or we could go old west style and start kicking asses in the parking lot! My entire point is rather than focus as cowards on single men, we should be focusing on creeps. People who think that nudist areas are for some level of sexual pleasure, or freak shows, or people who refuse to get nude themselves and follow the general practiced rules, bring a towel, be nice, enjoy the pool, be courteous, and have a general sense of decorum around other people. I hate to refer back to the swingers club, but they sort of have this figured out. While they do like their sex, the sex is ruled to the sexual areas, no pool sex, no public personal pleasure is allowed. This keeps the freaks at bay, because they have trained their staff to watch for idiots. As a single nudist I meet tons of women who I have great conversations with and occasionally they will proposition, and it’s easy to decline and not be an A-hole. The gay thing is not tolerated. And that makes me more comfortable because I am surrounded by like minded nudists and couples enjoying the sunshine.
You tackle a lot of interesting angles here.
One is indeed the large gay community within nudism. We’re not sure where this comes from but it probably has several reasons. Because nudists, in general, are quite accepting and open-minded, we understand that gays often feel more comfortable in a nudist setting. On the other hand, it’s also well known that public nudity has been part of the gay community for quite a time (gay saunas, dark rooms,…) and often used to find a (sex)partner.
Another one is looking for a partner within nudism. As mentioned in this blog post, women sometimes feel offended when being approached by a single man. While this also often happens at non-nudist settings (work, bar,…) and this appears to be less of an issue. This makes it pretty complicated to find a nudist partner at a nudist venue because you might be seen as a pervert just because you’re trying to strike up a conversation with women.
On the other hand, it does seem to bother you as well when you’re being approached by a gay guy. Which is basically the same.
And yes, weeding out the perverts is important to make everyone feel more comfortable. But so is trying to get a more male/female balance. Even if there were singles only resorts, if the large majority of the guests are male, this will chase away single women.
This is a great article about a complicated issue. I agree with your conclusion. Even though I’ve been married to my wife for 38 years, if I go to a nudist resort alone without her, I’m a single man. I have not considered myself single in 38 years. I think the solution is as you’ve stated. Bad behavior should be dealt with swiftly and en masse. If a woman is made to feel uncomfortable, this should not be tolerated for an instant. My daughter has been to nudist resorts with me. I will not tolerate harassment to her or any other woman. Bad behavior is unacceptable.
I’m fairly new to naturism and just spent a few days at a naturist resort. While looking for a place to have my first resort experience I found that most allowed single males on an individual basis. I’m not a gawker or looking to ‘hook-up’ just somewhere to be accepted and enjoy naturism. Having found an accepting resort, I now intend to revisit them and to find others. As a closing note, most of the resorts/clubs that were men only were also gay venues.
Right. I don’t expect an all-male straight nudist venue to stay in business very long.
Well… because of anti-discrimination laws, an all-male straight nudist venue won’t exist in the first place 😉
OK – Roman said ” I don’t expect an all-male straight nudist venue to stay in business very long.” Roman also said that “most of the resorts/clubs that were men only were also gay venues.” He said most, not all. What I want to ask is this: Is there any such thing as an all male straight nudist venue? If there was I would love to go to one. I have never encountered one, however. Which is a shame. Not that long ago men had may options for being nude together in a straight setting. There were nude swimming holes. The YMCA pools were nude before the 1970s when it was all male. Skinny dipping was part of both boy scout camp and YMCA summer camp. Until this century it was common for men’s locker rooms to have nude saunas, steam rooms and whirlpools. And, of course, we showered in the nude together. We had lots of great conversations. No more. Even men’s steam rooms and saunas have mostly been replaces by co-ed ones which require swim suits. Open showers have become pretty much extinct except in conservative areas with small and not very visible gay populations. The traditional all-male venues that still exist – especially swimming holes – have either disappeared or become mostly gay. The straight male’s traditional venues have been all but obliterated except for Korean and Russian spas. I see a number of all male nudist venues online and they all seem to be gay. I found three in Vermont – one was gay, one was heavily gay and the third had a website that gave no indication. Many straight men would love to have an all male nudist venue. I would. Can anyone here tell me if there is such a thing and, if so, what and where?
Hi Will, it’s pretty logical. The male gay community often prefers men-only venues and you can’t discriminate on sexual preference. Add these two factors together and it’s not hard to see why there are little to none all-straight-male venues.
The question is: Does this really matter? We have no experience with male-only venues because we always travel as an m/f couple. But from what we hear, the real male-only naturist venues are enjoyable for both straight and gay men. One problem is that many male-only places tend to be rather swingers/sex venues.
You make an interesting comparison with the YMCA. But there’s also a big difference. At places like the YMCA, the focus is not on social nudity, but on other things like sports. The social nudity is just one aspect of that. We see the same with nude-obligatory wellness centers in Europe, which tend to attract more women and young people than naturist venues. Also at the wellness, the focus is not on the social nudity but on relaxation.
Very good, sensible and well balanced article, thanks N&L! Some great comments too. Unfortunately I too am one of those guys who’s wife of 20 years is not at all interested in taking her clothes off in public places, even when that place is a naturist club and is very safe/secure. It’s just not for her nor will it ever be I suspect. She’s fine with me going to my local naturist sauna club on a Sunday evening (Bracknell – very friendly, good facilities) and the off beach where she will keep her kit firmly on, as will my son, but often I find I am going to places on my own if I can squeeze in a day in summer at Studland beach for instance, so I am very aware of the single male issue.
To be honest it doesn’t really bother me and I get on with just enjoying the time I have and generally keeping to myself but am very happy to chat with anyone if the opportunity arises, partly to dispel any suspicion that I am in any way dodgy or there for the wrong reasons.
I did visit a local naturist club a couple of summers ago as a guest (I camped for 2 nights) and had a great time, met some very friendly people and got on well with all of them. All in all a very positive experience. But when I inquired about becoming a member, chiefly so I could take advantage of the Wednesday evening sauna nights, I was told a flat no – because I was joining as a single male. If my wife came along and joined too, no problem. But on my own it was a no – they already had their ‘quota’ of single males and the committee had expressed concern recently (apparently) that there were too many of those in the club! So I had no chance, which was a bit dispiriting but in a way I can understand their policy of maintaining a decent gender balance. The fact that the average age of the members seemed to be over 60 and I’m still in my 40’s didn’t make any difference at all!
On another note I went to Euronat last summer for a week and spent a day at CHM Montalivet. What a revelation! Both places with a fabulous mix of men and women of all ages, sizes etc. just enjoying the freedom to be naked (or not) with no sense of unease or strange behaviour, not that I saw anyway. Being a single guy in such a massive place with so many people was not a problem, though it would have been so much better to share the experience with my wife and son. Such is life.
Thanks for sharing your story David!
Indeed, if you’re quite social and talkative, even as a single man it’s pretty easy to make friends at nudist places. People are often a bit on guard when they see a guy by himself, but it’s not hysterical.
Unfortunately, we’ve also seen things the other way. A resort owner received the message that some guy was acting weird near the swimming pool. When the owner went over to talk with the guy, apparently he was a bit asocial but he had also read the horror stories about single men being refused at naturist resorts. So he figured: “I got in, I’m just going to keep quiet in a corner so I don’t disturb anyone”. This, of course, made him look weird.
The advantage of large resorts like Euronat and CHM is that they don’t need quota. They get thousands of guests every day so there will always be some kind of balance. Even if it’s 3000 women and 4000 men, nobody will notice. And they have a well-trained security staff to locate and kick out anyone who misbehaves.
The smaller clubs, like the one you mention, are much more fragile and can’t do much else than limit the number of singles if they want to keep a certain balance.
That “weird” guy would probably be me at points. As a single male I know that no one “wants” me there like they would a single female, so I stay to myself. I am social enough to hold my end of a conversation if someone engages me, but I have not yet mastered the art of striking up a conversation.
This is mostly due to the fact that everyone has this fear of men in non-nude society anyway, I don’t engage unless I have to or the interaction feels organic.
Interesting etiquette rules from AANR – https://aanrwest.org/behavior.html
“AANR-West cannot tell a club how to run its business, but we endeavor to have all the clubs in the region realize the financial and moral obligation they can achieve with a wider customer base”
Yet AANR does enforce the family-friendly rules on their affiliated resorts but not the acceptance of singles.
Wow, interesting ,subjects like these always have so many comments.
yes and all interesting ideas
I view this issue as akin to that of the reaction of white folks, particularly women, who fear an encounter with a black man or men while in public places. Yes, some black men are predators and some men will go to clothing optional locales to gawk or otherwise misbehave but to discriminate against all single men because of the action of a few is as wrong as discrimination against black men because of the behavior of a few.
Jeffrey, I don’t understand your focus on black men as ‘predators’. Just look how many non-black men have been convicted of harassing or assaulting women. And there are very few black people on European naturist locations, so the behavior of some black men cannot explain the gender imbalance.
There might have been some confusion. As we understood it, Jeffrey makes the comparison with black men on a more general level, not immediately focused on naturism. From that point of view, we agree that the scare of single men at naturist places is similar to the scare of black people in general. In most cases, it’s unfounded and makes not much sense at all.
i agree i dont think its just a black man thing my wife and me have had conversations while at haulover with both black and white sgl men its usually not hard to tell which ones are just creepy and up to no good maybe we should have a way where if a sgl guy wants to go to the nude beach or resort he can arrange for a couple to go at same time might be a way to make more friends in the nudist community. i know it sounds odd but i do understand why a sgl guy seems out of place at times
Hypocrits are men bashing, equal rights ignored and businesses abuse male gender with charges. I found a place south of Detroit where watching tv with some people in front of it was termed STARING. The joy of being in the nude is killed by people who invite females to offer the married men some alternative views from the daily bore. Thanks for reading.
Wow! As a textile guy, reading this article, it’d clearly quite pathetic how people and associations who claim that ‘naturism isnt about sex’ are behaving and demonizing single people. If a black person were segregated, people would be up in arms! Surely, it’s more correct to have a system of enforcement which clamps down on trouble-makers, instead of pre-judging single people? As if it’s not hard enough for a single person to holiday alone in the first place!
Thanks for your comment Neal and as you say, discrimination is wrong. Period.
With this blog post we tried to explain the different angles of this complex issue.
The comparison with black people is correct until a certain point. Indeed, if a black person was not allowed entry in whatever place, there would be trouble. But it does happen that when many black people start going to the same bar, fewer white people will go (and vice versa of course). In the end, the bar will keep existing.
If lots of single men start going to the same naturist club, it could also happen that fewer couples will go. The main question is: if this club becomes known as male dominant or even male-only, will also the single men keep going there?
There are a small number of issues here, not least of which is prejudice toward single men, both price wise and assuming we’re all perverts. More worrying is the business of ‘managing ratios’, to boost popularity of a venue, much like nightclubs. It appears to me to be precisely opposite to the naturist lifestyle of freedom. By inviting more women, they are objectifying women, in order to provide more eye candy’. This, in itself, leads to the idea that naturist women are there to be ogled. I find that appalling. It’s supposed to be about everyone equally enjoying sun, sea and sand, is it not?
It is said above that most men straight men were not interested in going to an all male nudist venue and that the mixed gender concept was important to them. One of the reasons for that is that, nowadays, all-male nudist venues are generally all gay or predominantly gay. Most straight male nudists would not be comfortable with that. Some nudist men don’t feel comfortable being nude in front of gay men at all , while others don’t mind as long as gay men don’t predominate. They don’t want to be tagged as gay. They fear that in a predominantly gay setting that they will get hit on or at least oogled at. I think that a lot of straight male nudists – especially those who are discriminated against by standard nudist resorts – would gladly go to an all male resort if it wasn’t predominantly gay or gay oriented. They could enjoy the camaraderie that men once had when traditional male communal nudity was the norm in American life. Many of us miss that. I myself miss it. But there just doesn’t seen to be many – or any – straight-oriented male nudist venues in this country. So straight single male nudists are discriminated by mixed gender nudist resorts and vexed by the utter lack of straight oriented all-male nudist resorts. So sad, so sad.
It’s hard not to see the comparison with women in nudism. One of their big fears about male-dominated places is also that they don’t want to get hit on or oogled at.
This was also a point we tried to make in this blog post. A lot of straight men seem to find it ridiculous that women feel insecure or objectified at places that are male-dominant, but they find it reasonable that they feel insecure at places that are gay-dominant.
I find it is woman who are new to naturism feel this why, that they are being “hit on”, woman who have grown up in the lifestyle or going to years don’t. I believe it is really up to the clubs to explain about naturism for “newbies”, so woman visiting a club for the first time, won’t feel this way. As you know Bare Oaks, does a great job with this on their website. It is up to the clubs to educate to public on naturism, so outsiders and new people won’t feel uncomfortable.
Newbies in naturism feel very vulnerable, that’s completely normal and exactly how we felt the first time. It’s indeed up to the clubs and organizations to educate both those who try nudism for the first time as the long time nudists about how to treat newbies.
Thank you for starting this discussion. Two observations here- firstly men only facilities are often seen as places for gay men to meet, and a straight man does not want to witness this or be approached, and secondly, much of the gender balance issue is the US or UK. Go to a spa or beach in Germany or France and the gender balance is there, or sometimes a majority women as friends go there for a day out together.
Interesting that you mention the spa culture. Because those places are often not seen as “naturist”. The main difference is that the at the spa, the nudity isn’t the main focus point. Destressing and relaxing is. Social nudity is just part of it. While at many naturist places, there’s a lot of focus on the nudity.
Great article and as a single male nudist, I have felt these issues personally and witnessed them as well. I’ve been approached by single men and asked if I wanted to join that man for some fun. I’ve witnessed single men gawking and masturbating on the beach in front of women and I have been excluded from naturists parties simply because they would charge a single male 3-4 times the admission fee of a couple and I could not afford or see doing that.
One thing I found that helped, you actually mentioned. At ur beach, they (those that were there before me) set up Beach Ambassadors. A group of individuals – typically men, who would act on behalf of the group to police the community, enforce rules, answer questions and offer guidance. At 6’4″ I am a bit intimidating to many, so it was a perfect fit. I’d walk the beach, introduce myself to couple (first) and singles (men then women) so that others would be able to observe that I was not a threat. I made many friends and couple and women would soon realize that they could count on me to step in when someone acted inappropriately. I also knew I had the backing of the other ambassadors so someone always had our back. It made people feel much safer and they didn’t need to worry about involving actual law enforcement – which just creates a bigger mess and often results in these incidents being used to eliminate a C/O status.
So yes, Single men may be 80% of the incidents – though I did witness one incident where a woman actually sat in the single mens view and teased them (I think you can imagine how without details). Though I never saw it, I felt that somewhere in the “audience” she had a partner watching her. It was totally obvious that she was not a regular nor had been to this beach before. Not one man complained about this, despite the fact that she was filming them when she did this. I probably wasn’t the most popular man on the beach that day when I put a stop to it.
Such a fantastic overview and consideration of this topic as well as engaging comments. Thank you!!
Hi! Sorry that this is coming late, but I just stumbled on this article again and wanted to report that I tried out your advice last summer, some time after reading it for the first time.
Some men came to the local nude beach – clothed and in a somewhat sneaky way, so I wondered if they didn’t know where they were or if were just there for gawking. I walked up to them, explained to them that it was a nude beach, and invited them to get naked, too. Unfortunately, they didn’t, but they didn’t stay around gawking either. I consider this a win and will continue 🙂
However, in hindsight I am a little bit worried about being too aggressive – I don’t want to scare away potential first-timers either.
Awesome that you gave this a try Chris!
Unfortunately, there is no exact science about how to do this right and we have also seen situations where this backfired when some guy started yelling at a family “Hey! This is a nudist place, take off your clothes!”. The family was obviously new to nudism and it’s possible that this was the first and last time that they gave it a try.
Communication is important. Don’t be the nudist police and order people to get naked, but have a chat with them. Ask them where they are from, if they’ve been to nude beaches before, etc. Most likely, their intentions will become clear before you need to tell them that this is a nude beach and that the etiquette is that they get naked.
We’re quite convinced that if the person came to look at the naked women, the last thing he’ll want is some nude guy coming over to chit-chat. And if he came to look at the naked men, that’ll also become quite obvious 🙂
I’m not a single male, but my wife and children aren’t naturists. So when I visit places I get classified as a single male. And it has let to me being excluded from a number of places. I get it, but that doesn’t make it any more pleasant. Unfortunately I don’t know that there is a simple answer to this issue.
That does indeed happen, unfortunately. “Single male” doesn’t necessarily mean your relationship status, but rather defines how/with whom you visit the place. We’ve heard stories about gay couples who were also treated as two single males.
I live in Minnesota and there are two naturist clubs I know about, Oakwood and Avatan. I have been to Avatan before as a single male. Over the years I’ve emailed Oakwood about visiting, they have never returned my emails. Avatan currently is not allowing any single males to visit. Here’s where it gets really interesting.
I asked Avatan if this was to keep the male-female ratio balanced. I was told yes. I then asked would I be allowed to visit if I brought a boyfriend (though I am a straight man and not gay or bisexual). They said absolutely and would be delighted to have us visit. This made no sense to me because while one man attending is not allowed because it would offset the gender balance, two men are allowed to attend. I asked why two men are allowed to attend together but one man isn’t, especially since two men would offset the gender balance more than the single man. I was told because Avatan doesn’t count two gay men attending together as “two men.” They count them as “a couple.” This rattled my brain so much because I couldn’t believe how they could not see the inconsistency.
Apparently, according to Avatan, all couples are the same in which in no way could any amount of couples ever offset the gender balance. So, hypothetically, a dozen gay male couples could attend with another dozen male-female couples attending, and that wouldn’t offset the gender balance because 24 gay men (12 couples) doesn’t offset the gender balance like 24 single men would. Bottomline, Avatan strongly discriminates against single men. I question going back to Avatan, even if they do allow single men to attend at some point. Meanwhile, all I can do is be a home nudist.
Nick & Lins, thank you for becoming aware of this. Don’t feel bad for being oblivious to this problem. Thank you for realizing it, bringing attention to it, and defending the single men who behave themselves (like me).
Thanks a lot for sharing your story, Matt!
We have much more experience in Europe than in the USA, and from what we’ve seen, the major reason why European resorts tend to be much more single male friendly is that they operate much more like businesses. They know that if they would not allow you, the resort next door probably will and they will lose a customer.
There are different opinions about whether the commercialization of naturism is a good thing or not, but we believe that it is. It may sound strange that in their eyes you’re not a man, woman, or couple anymore, but mostly a customer who will spend money. But eventually, it’s good to create a balance and to treat people in equal ways.
Of course, naturism in Europe is not like the USA, and we can’t tell you how things will evolve. But we do hope that the European way of handling it will cross the ocean one day!
There is also the happy middle area. Solair in Woodstock, CT, USA. Is a member’s own resort, but it operates like a textile resort. Except for the fact, you have to be nude of course and they do a background check, by scanning your ID when you enter and having to do a tour for first-timers. But they have to offer, and the way they advertise is very much like any textile resort. They have billboards on the highway and are in the CT tourist books.
That is really the way forward. We can’t expect the world to embrace nudism when we keep hiding. And this doesn’t mean that we need to start walking naked in the cities (which is illegal in many cases) but just like have decent advertising. Tell the world that we exist.
This an interesting subject. I have been a single male nudist many times, as well as having been in relationships with nudist women. I’ve never been a club nudist, the nearest I’ve done to that is to occasionally go to a naturist swim at a local leisure centre that’s run by a club. I was single when I was doing that, and while it wasn’t a problem, the club were happy for me to go along as a single, one of the club members (male) did suggest to me one night that it would be ‘better’ if I could find a female friend to take along. I never did take a friend to this swim, and I was always welcomed.
I am more the outdoor and ‘free’ type of nudist. I don’t like to be restricted in where I can go. Even if I go to my favourite official naturist beach, I’ll go way beyond the marked boundaries. It’s not illegal to be nude in public here, so it’s a bit ridiculous having marked out designated areas where you can go nude, when in fact legally you can go nude anywhere you like. When I have been single, and I’ve spent days on end walking around beaches in the nude I haven’t really encountered any problems. I would say though, that I have noticed a slight difference in how clothed people react to you when you’re a nude man on your own and when you’re a nude man accompanied by a woman.
The part about voyeurs, gay men and whether women spy on or stare at men or stand blocking your view with their genitals was an interesting observation. I’ve been doing this a long time, forty-five years, and I’ve experienced most of these things…
At the official naturist beach, I often go to there is an area in the dunes mostly used by gay men. One day, and I wasn’t single, my girlfriend was with me, but I left her lying on the beach and went for a walk along the top of the quite high dunes. The view from there is amazing in all directions. As I was walking along the sandy path, I met a man (I’d guess in his 50’s – I was mid-30’s at the time) coming in the opposite direction. He stopped to exchange pleasantries, but then with no warning he took hold of my penis! I quickly knocked his hand away and said, “Whoa, that’s for ladies only!” He immediately apologised, said he’d mistakenly thought I was gay and made a hasty retreat. So yes, men making unsolicited and inappropriate approaches on other men does happen.
In terms of women looking at men, in my own experience it’s more likely to be clothed/textile women or young girls (they are the worst), but they don’t hide in the dunes and spy from a distance like male perverts do, no, they are more blatant, they’ll wander over and say hello and stand there blatantly looking. The younger ones often ask stupid questions like “Are you a nudist?” and also sometimes even comment on things like the size of your penis. It’s just that they’re at that age when they’re testing things out. I ask them where their parents are and suggest they should go and find them.
Normally adult women don’t make comments like that, but I have a piercing in mine, I’ve had it a long time now. It’s not the usual Prince Albert one, it’s called a Frenum piercing. That’s the web of skin on the underside of the penis just between the glans and where the foreskin would be attached. I’m circumcised. The ring I have it can be left to hang, or it is large enough to roll it back over the glans so that it sits behind the ridge of the glans like a collar. I originally had this done at the request of a girlfriend because it provides enhanced stimulation during sex, it was nothing to do with being a nudist. The upshot though is that it becomes a talking point that seems to make some women feel that it opens the door to looking closely and talking about it. “Did it hurt?” “I like your piercing!” “You have a nice [penis, dick, cock, willy, etc.]” Women wouldn’t normally do that, even on a nudist beach.
So, being a single male nudist can attract all kinds of attention, some good, some bad. I have never really experienced any discrimination personally, apart from the suggestion by the swimming club guy, but I’m sure it does happen.
I’m one of the older widowers who has been denied entry alone. It’s discrimination, but I doubt the courts would be any help.
I think a reason there seems to be more male nudists than female, is body image. Women are much more concerned about it. Remember, women don’t dress for men, they dress for other women to see them.
Very good article but you have missed a very important point that’s the very problem of this issue. Nude clubs & resorts were set up mainly by male hetrosexuals who’s main aim was to see more naked women, thus they made the rules to suit. Do nudist clubs/resorts refuse single woman? Most likely not,its the old primitive male ego at work. The more naked women around them then the primitive dominant instincts kick in and they feel more manly or comfortable. They don’t like single men because they feel threaten as it might be competition or take away their dominance/ control or feel inferior. Its the same when they’re threaten by gay single men and I can tell you most gay men aren’t interested in them. Most nude beaches I go to in Australia the women move closer to the gay men area because they feel less threaten by the gay males than the hetrosexul ones but the hetrosexual men on the beach are trying to make a campaign against gay men to have them removed so they can have total control & dominence over women. If men in these clubs & resorts truely believe that Nudity is a life style & natural for everyone, then there should be no gender or sexuality restrictions. There is no 50/50 balance in normal society or restrictions on single men, so why is there in nudist club? I see some families at nudist clubs that have restrictions on single men yet they have 3 young adult single sons. No one questions them about imblance that they might be causing to the group/club? It just over regulation designed to support male control, discrimination or hate and the nudist movement needs to move forward & catch up with the rest of the world. If your so called comfortable with your body naked & people are respectful, then it shouldn’t matter if your single or not nor your sexuality.
We very much disagree with this. We’ve visited very many naturist clubs and resorts and pretty much all of them were started by a couple or family. We have never heard about a single man or group of single men who started a naturist club in order to see more naked women.
This being said, we do know that some naturist men have a “show me your wife and I’ll show you mine” attitude when it comes to visiting naturist resorts with their partner and feel threatened by single men. And we also agree that some naturist men think that spending time naked with only other naked men is not all that good for their ego.
These are issues that resorts need to cope with and why they have gender quota.
Thank you for the insights.
I live in a country where the nearest beach is over 600 km away, and the only options are resorts. (No free places to go to.) Four years ago only one allowed “single” males or ones like myself (63yo, married 35 years but wife does not participate).
If you join the nudist federation, you are now allowed into the resorts, at the same price as any other single. Perverts are quickly dealt with by resort management to protect their reputation.
There is also a gay nudist resort nearby, which I had never visited nor wish to. The best way to describe my feelings is as follows: A while ago I went to a family get together at a private venue. My cousin made the comment that he would buy such a venue and turn it into a gay nudist resort. My immediate reaction was that he would be doing it for the wrong reason, since nudism is in my opinion not related to sexuality and by imposing this rule you are immediately making it about sex. (A Naturist resort is explicitly not about sex, so why does it matter?)
The same rule applies at a normal resort when imposing rules about male/female rations and couples. The thing I most enjoy about naturism is the freedom, and that I enter the conversation on equal terms with the other participants, weather doctors, lawyers, mechanics, bankers or sanitation workers. Everyone deserves equal respect. I would love a situation that is as close to normal everyday living, but without the necessity for clothing.
Another interesting idea why we have the discrimination is that when attending a resort as a couple, the wife will “police” the husbands behaviour, whereas single men do not have the same constraints. Therefore men together with their partners are much less likely to misbehave.
I have however found that a lot of couples attending the resorts are in fact swingers. They are generally accepted and as long as they behave, they are welcome. Question: Do they attend the resorts as naturists, or because advertising pays? A means to meet other like minded couples? Even as a non attractive older man, I’ve been proposed to twice by the wives in the couples. Not openly, but the “we are swingers and looking” conversations.
Let me also be clear about this. I have nothing against swingers and gays, and at resorts there should be a “force” to deal with bad behaviour, but mostly if anything happens that I don’t approve of, I simply shut it down asap.
It is not only the responsibility of the owners or other people, but of all of us together. Look after yourself and other more vulnerable members around you, and the entire movement will benefit.
In other words, don’t concern yourselves with male/female/single/gay, but just spend the energy identifying and getting rid or the undesirable perverts.
You’re absolutely right, the problems are not to be found with a certain group of people, but with individuals. From our limited experience with naturism in SA, we already notice that it’s coming a long way and that it seems to be improving. Small steps at a time.
The issue that resorts are reluctant to accept singles is something that can be found around the world. We’ve identified 2 main reasons for this: The first one is, as you mentioned, that single men tend to cause more problems than couples. This doesn’t mean that every single man misbehaves, but it’s a proven statistic.
The other reason is that they want to maintain a male/female balance because they are afraid that too many single men will cause women and couples to stop coming.
It’s all quite complicated, and we think that the most important is to put energy in attracting the right people instead in trying to prevent the wrong people to come.