Can a nudist feel comfortable in a sensual resort?

Can a nudist feel comfortable in a sensual resort?

For us, nudists, swingers are the antichrist. They give us a bad name, they flock our beaches and they even hijacked the term “lifestyle” in the USA so every time we told someone that we enjoyed the nudist lifestyle (we had no clue…) people frowned and gave us a dirty look. And now they’re building these huge fancy resorts all over the world. What do they do over there? Behind their fancy walls? It can’t be anything else than that those places are dens of iniquity, where people have sex in broad daylight and where from one moment on another spontaneous orgies arise. Right?

 

And then something downed to us… What do we actually know about those places? And aren’t before mentioned prejudices the same as people used to have about nudists? What if swingers aren’t just a bunch of perverts looking for every opportunity to engage in public disgrace with someone else’s partner? What if they are a friendly bunch of people who just happen to be not monogamous?
There’s only one way to find out…
And “luckily” for us, the Mexican coast happens to have a couple of those resorts which promise a “sensual” and “intimate” vacation. So one day we found ourselves in front of the gates of Desire Resort, curious about what was going on behind those doors and wondering whether we, as genuine nudists and a monogamous couple, would be able to have a good time there.

What about the nudist values?
Ok, we overreacted a bit in the introduction. We clearly remembered when we accidentally stumbled upon a swingers party in Brazil years ago. And during our travels over the last year we have had other encounters with swingers as well, sometimes they just told us, on one occasion this came together with an invite which we friendly declined and sometimes the rumour passed by via the word of mouth from the other guests.
This was something that started to bother us, everybody knew that this or that couple were swingers but they just acted like it wasn’t true. They just looked the other way.
They had to, many nudist clubs are struggling to gain new members so the worst thing they could do was start kicking members out and neither did they want to give it a name because then it would become real and people would think it was a swinger resort. In the end, the swingers didn’t really break the rules either, yes they went with four to the bedroom, but at least they closed the door.

 

Another interesting thing we had noticed by talking to many other nudists and which had sparkled our interest to check out the Desire was that several young nudist couples admitted that they like to go to sensual places. Although they’re certainly not swingers themselves and they don’t have the slightest intention to have sex in public, they knew that the parties at those places are often amazing. Now and then they wanted to exchange the weekly karaoke night for a foam party with a good deejay and techno music that lasted until the early hours.
Were they breaking down one of the pillars of nudism: non-sexual nudity?
Are we breaking down our own ethics by going to a sensual resort?
Maybe we can compare it with another lifestyle: Is it unethical for a vegetarian to visit a meat restaurant and just eat a salad? By going to that restaurant, the veggie is giving money to the meat industry just like by going to Desire we were giving money to the…ehm (boy would we like to say “meat industry” here as well, but let’s stick with “sexual nudity”) that industry.

Why should we go there?
The big question is why you should go a to place that is not in line with the nudist values instead of giving your money to any of the local clubs who are already struggling and could use it much better?
These sensual resorts have several kinds of visitors and the main reasons for their visit are the lifestyle aspect, the nudism or the whole experience.
Lifestyle means that theoretically you can have sex wherever and whenever you want and that nobody will give you a dirty look if it’s not happening with your own partner or with just one partner. Now we have to be careful because what we’re going to say can be easily misunderstood… The amount of sex we saw was quite disappointing. During the two days we were at Desire, we can probably count the cases of sexual activity on one hand, most of it happend after dark and at places of which we were warned that it would happen: the hot tub and the playroom. Most of the time the resort looked like a genuine nudist resort, only with loud music and more cocktails.

 

Another interesting thing we noticed was that we were never asked if we were swingers or if we were interested in any of those activities. The whole time we felt very comfortable as genuine nudists. (Afterwards we heard that many swingers have small signs, visual and verbal, which make it easier for them to recognise each other).
We did meet a lot of other nudists at the Desire as well who all had their different reasons to come there: Some for the parties, some for the all-inclusive formula, some for the top quality food, some for the staff and the hundreds of activities that are organised and some because they like the sensual atmosphere. It spices up their sex lives even though they still choose to keep it among each other and in their room.

All kinds of nudists
We’ve probably already said this a million times, the term “nudist” has become impossible to define. More and more people start to turn towards nudity and see the advantages of it, but they also have many different reasons to do so. Trying to stick to a general definition is not going to work anymore and above is yet another example.
We have met nudist families and nudist couples who don’t want their children to know. We’ve met 24/7 nudists and holiday nudists. We’ve met nudists who like peace and quietness and we’ve met nudists who like big parties. We’ve met camping nudists and luxury resort nudists. We’ve met nudists who like nature and nudists who like big cities. We’ve met nudists who like the connection with mother earth and nudists who like the equal tan. And then there are the gay nudists and single nudists and young nudists and older nudists and whatever other type of nudist that still has to come.
It’s impossible to cater for all of those at the same type of organisation.

 

But we digress and we still haven’t answered our own question. Can a genuine nudist feel comfortable at a sensual place? We would say yes, but only if you are prepared to redraw the lines of nudism. You might encounter sexual activity, there’s much more looking and being looked at and being naked is not the top priority of the resort, which results in dress code for some parts of the resort. Never during the time we were there we felt forced in any way or made uncomfortable. In fact, the biggest rule at those types of resorts is “No means NO”. Cross that line and you’re out! We were respected as nudists and we respected those with other ideas.

 

IMPORTANT NOTE: Desire Resorts are pretty high end and they are the only place we visited to base this article on. We can’t say if this is the same for every “sensual” resort. A complete review of the resorts will follow later.

 

Picture credit: All photos in this post are property of Desire Resorts and should not be duplicated or republished without their approval.

66 thoughts on “Can a nudist feel comfortable in a sensual resort?

  1. We tried Hedonism and did not like it at all. The swinger people were so concerned with hooking up they would not even talk to you or acknowledge you if they did not want to have sex with you. This is the complete opposite we found at every other nudist place. Where everyone was very friendly and welcoming.

    1. We kind of experienced the same, we’ve met a lot of people during our stay at the Desire resorts but most of them were genuine nudists. The swingers seemed to only connect with their own… ehm… lifestyle.

  2. Nick & Lins,
    Thanks for opening our eyes to the Sensual Nudist Resorts. Having your “Eyes Wide Shut” and your mind not able to see there is a demand for places where people can be more open and intimate in a non judgmental environment is not only becoming more popular for the young but also the young at heart! Looking forward to your review of more of the “Sensual” Nude Spaces ;).. Cheers!

    1. We believe that ignoring that these places exist is not doing nudism any good… but that doesn’t mean that we’ll visit them often in the future. We still remain genuine nudists and will focus mostly on nudist venues

      1. That’s a good point, we don’t have to ignore this group of people … some of them are genuine nudists and I have my respect for them. What I can’t swallow are those beautiful nudist places that are taken over by swingers where there’s no autorithy to control such places and renamed by them. They are plenty of them all over the world. I have swingers friends, I
        RESPECT them just the way they RESPECT me and some are real friends.

        1. We believe that somebody can be both a swinger as a nudist, depending on the place they visit. And that’s perfectly fine. That swingers are taking over nudist places is often cause because resorts actually started to attract them or loosened their rules and thus give the swingers more space to do “their thing”. Here we see a task for the federations. AANR for example currently focuses 100% on family nudism and places that don’t allow children cannot become affiliated. But on the other hand there are a lot of nudists who prefer not to have children around, often because it’s more quiet. So there are nudist places of both kinds but the federation only controls those that are child friendly. For the “adult only” nudist there is no guarantee whether the place they want to visit is a genuine nudist resort or a swingers place hiding behind the nudist name.

  3. As a traditional naturist I have absolutely no problem with venues like this existing and advertising themselves as sensual or exotic or any of the other key words that inform straight away that the venue has liberation that goes beyond naturism into something sexual. It’s right there on the tin, and only a fool would go to a place called ‘Desire’ and then have the gall to moan that there was sexual nudity going on. If you understand what the venue is, then even as a traditional naturist you can still go and then blind yourself to the aspects you’re not comfortable with (a bit like with Cap d’Agde in France). The only risk with that is that you going may lead to others getting the wrong idea and 2 and 2 are put together with 5 the result by those you know! The biggest issue though is slightly oblique to this blog. It concerns venues that DON’T give an immediate clue, and that hide behind naturism as a label when they are clearly not JUST that. The UK has several venues like this and I think from a relaxed naturist’s perspective it’s this problem that fuels the distrust and dislike. For example venues that call themselves “Neutral-term Naturist Club” and then advertise no link with sex EXCEPT to say that they have ‘private rest rooms for you to enjoy’. That’s the rather cowardly indicator that the venue tolerates sexual behaviour yet for a nervous newbie nudie this might be difficult to spot or interpret. So venues that are clear in what they are, no problem and I wish them all the best and succeed in making us all a little bit less conservative, but venues that hide what they are behind traditional naturism because they are too timid to declare it openly, go hang. That’s where I get cross. I’d love naturism to cease being a label and become simply a normalised state of dress for me to choose. That’s made a lot more unlikely every time someone comes across a justified link between something called Naturist and something sexual. The world is not ready to be THAT liberal. One baby step at a time else we only go backwards.

    1. Indeed, we have considered adding this to our article, about the fact that lifestyle places are hiding behind the name nudism. We’ve heard a lot about such places but have luckily never encountered one. As we prefer to give only first hand information, we decided to leave this out eventually. But you’re totally right that these places are the worst. They should take responsibility and ownership and call themselves what they really are.

      1. Ironically Hedo was billed as a Nudist Resort that is “Lifestyle Friendly”. Baloney. It’s a lifestyle resort that you may find a few nudists. Watching people have sex did not bother me at all, we did it too with each other. But the fact that when they found out we were not lifestyle people they avoided us like the plague. That was just weird. We have stayed down in Xcalac with Murph. We had a really good time down there.

  4. Funny story. The very first time we tried a nudist resort we had a wonderful time. It wasn’t until the last day, when my husband finally asked someone what “The Lifestyle” was that we found out that there was actually a Lifestyle convention going on and we were probably the only “nudists” at the place. We were never propositioned, we never saw any outrageous behavior or public sex. We did have a great time, enjoyed the people, appreciated their comfortable attitude towards sex and having fun. We went back to the same resort several more times and have met swingers at just about every resort in Mexico, Jamaica and Florida. We are not interested in being swingers, we are nudists. Anyone who thinks nudists should be open minded and non judgemental shouldn’t go around judging Lifestylers, especially if they’ve never really talked to some.

    1. Laura but thats exactly why ppl will connect nudism with sex .. for the fact that u dont mind it.
      Id also would ask u something ,but i wont, it would be maybe rude or some like that , so i dont wanna.

  5. Ooookay this is one of those subjects hah… where i think i wont really agree..or i can, it depends.
    I guess i understand what u wanna say .. that nudist is a nudist, this way or that way .. and i would understand that, if u were talking to ppl that dont like nudism , or are not nudists like my self or so (but imma be neutral since i dont have nudists ,but i aint one).. but the fact is, that even nudists them selfs wont really agree that all nudists are nudists ,no matter what.
    And yah .. i quote ..”Can a genuine nudist feel comfortable at a sensual place? We would say yes, but only if you are prepared to redraw the lines of nudism.”
    With this, u cant say anymore then that nudism has nothing to do with sex , cause a genuine one would always say that those two dont go together(if they are not lieing all these decades just so they would make ppl aprove of it) ,and if that would be a new normal, wouldnt that mean then ,that there wouldnt be any nudist kids anymore? Cause those kinda places already exist,like swinger clubs and such where of course its not odd to be nude, but if nudism would redraw its lines, that those things wouldnt be limited only to those clubs, but it would be an all around normal, then wouldnt that mean ,no more nudie kids? Or ..a new form of morality would go with that ?
    Cause ya, ppl watch and stuff all the time, but on a textile beach or club for sure sensuality or sex outside or in ,is prolly not allowed nor it will be ever cause of the exact same thing.

    1. I disagree. Suggesting that being a nudist or that what a nudist is would be determined by geography seems ludicrous at best. If you believe that staying at one of these locations as a nudist means that we can no longer claim that nudism isn’t about sex then the claim that nudism isn’t about nudity because I get dressed to go to the mall must be equally valid.

      If somebody, nudist or otherwise, who is in a monogamous relationship goes to a venue of this nature they don’t suddenly become swingers. Their promiscuity levels don’t suddenly plunge through the floor.

      Kim and I attended an event here in Sydney called Sexpo, google it if you wish, which had everything from toy sellers to strippers (professional and amature), lingerie stockists to furniture sellers there. I’m sure that amongst the tens of thousands of visitors to this there would have been a philatelist or two. If your theory on location based values were to hold true then stamp collecting is a whole lot more exciting than I ever imagined.

      1. “Suggesting that being a nudist or that what a nudist is would be determined by geography seems ludicrous at best”
        Im afraid i have no clue what u ment by this.

        Of course, ppl will go to venues to check things out, relgardless if they are into it or not.. but most likely its a one time thing, .. imma go see this and thats it.And i never said that they become swingers.
        I`ve heard about Sexpo,as a matter a fact i`ve even seen some articles where ppl were bashing it cause they were advertizing it on buses that were taking primary school kids to school.. like with full webcam adresses ,dates all over the bus ,and such.
        But anyhow, either my english isnt good, or ur missing my whole point intentionally or not.

        1. In your comment you said:

          ‘And yah .. i quote ..”Can a genuine nudist feel comfortable at a sensual place? We would say yes, but only if you are prepared to redraw the lines of nudism.”
          With this, u can’t say anymore then that nudism has nothing to do with sex , cause a genuine one would always say that those two dont go together(if they are not lieing all these decades just so they would make ppl aprove of it) ,and if that would be a new ’

          What you are saying is that people, such as Kim and I can no longer claim that nudism is not about sex because we attended a venue that had swingers at it.

          Look at Cap d’Agde in France, the place started as a purely nudist location then started trending towards swingers. The location has a huge number of visitors that are there as nudists. They enjoy a full nudist life for the duration of their stay. They shop nude, dine nude, go to bars nude and never engage in any of the swinger related activities.

          Yet because of this you suggest that nudism suddenly becomes about sex?

          So to put my confusing statement more plainly your proposition that “If you go to one of these places then you can no longer say that nudism isn’t about sex” was one that I found so unfathomable that I would point at it and laugh, and not in a good way.

          Did we go to these places as a ‘one time thing to check them out’? No. At one place we visited we went a number of times over the course of a decade. Why? Because it was a full service resort with restaurants, bars pools, nightclub and room service where we could be nude wherever we choose. Had there been more traditional nudist facilities offering a similar level of service we’d have stayed there but there wasn’t.

          What I suspect is referenced in the “redraw the lines of nudism.” quote from the article is what is meant that if you go to a place of this nature you need to accept that things will be different to a nudist only venue. Not that what nudism is suddenly changes.

          1. that’s exactly what we meant with redrawing the lines, although we admit that this might not be the right choice of words. We should have said “redraw the lines of social nudity”.

          2. Sir i never mentioned u or ur wife as an example for/of anything.
            I only did a reply to Nick n Lins, they said ,thats the way i got it, about the new definition of nudism ,where its ok to have sex at a place where u at.
            And well .. if ur at a nudist place, and ppl are having opnely sex and every1s ok with that, then im sorry but ..
            As far as Cape d Agde, well its not true .. they do have sex on the beach,swing or non swing, that beach is seperated but just by an invisible “wall” , and i`ve seen a video where many of the ppl complain that ppl are having sex 5 meters away from their kids, again .. i didnt say this, nudists did.
            I also didnt say that nudism is sexual or not, its the nudists that always say that nudism doesnt have anything to do with sex, yet as we can see, there are alots of nudist places that are actually sexual , ..Cape as the mother of them all ,and now ,nudists talking more and more about sensual resorts, swingers, and having actual respect for swingers, even tho they give nudism a bad name,again ,this is said by nudists … its kinda confusing…
            I mean, are they ok or not?
            I dunno why u go there , its ur thing, tbh, a real naturist i guess would rather be in nature somewhere then in a fancy resort ,but nm that anyways…
            And i said it already in my 1st msg, these kind of places already exist! So in that sence, nudism already changed, meaning yes , there is a sexual nudism as well.
            But i was refering to redrawing the lines, that would mean generaly redrawing the lines.
            But its honestly enough to accept places like u mentioned ,and its already enough to say that nudism is or can be sexual.
            Nick Lins, social nudity, nudism, to me there aint no really difference.

    2. We see an issue in your reasoning here when you say that nudism and sex don’t go together….
      Would you say that textiles and sex go together? If so, why aren’t all textiles having sex in public places? And if not, is anyone still having sex?
      The idea that nudists are asexual is completely wrong and it has to be interpreted as nudism is not about sex. We are not naked because we get any sexual pleasure or advantages from it.

      The thing is that some swingers also like social nudity and some of them even do get sexual pleasure from it. Can they be considered genuine nudists? Well, that depends on the situation. Not all swingers want to swing all the time. We have met some who go to swingers places to do their thing but completely follow the rules when they’re at nudist places because they like the nudist lifestyle as well. One doesn’t necessarily exclude the other. The issues are with those who can’t (or don’t want to) separate one from the other.

      And not all swingers like the nudity by the way, there are lots of textile swingers places as well. Should the people who visit those be excluded from textile swimming pools where there are children even though they don’t do anything wrong?

      But back to our topic, we have already given the example in the article about vegetarians. If a vegetarian goes to a meat restaurant and orders a salad, does he or she become less vegetarian from doing so? Those who believe in the strong principles of animal rights will probably not go there, but those who are vegetarian for health reasons for example will probably not care at all. Similarly there are nudists for all sorts of reasons, some will have ethical issues with visiting a sensual place, others won’t.

      1. But u were talking about redrawing the lines of nudism ,hence that its ok if nudists have sex at the places they are at.
        Thats why i wrote what i wrote.
        No textile says they wanna redraw a line of what textilizm is lol ,nor any textile has ever said that textilizm cant be or isnt sexual. Thats what nudies say about nudism.
        But i dont really think ive heard that textiles are talking about making it ok for textiles to have sex at their beaches or resorts,and im not even talking about swingers, but just ppl who dont mind being seen or whatever, and like to do it in a crowd.
        Of course they will do it in a swinger club, pool or such, but thats different ,and of course there will be one or two that will actually do in on a regular public beach, but mostly they will be drunk af the chances are.
        Tho i recall once i read somewhere else, that someone wrote about why is sex such a big deal anyway, that why ppl need to hide it from any1 and such ,so when read that line redraw, i kinda recalled that article someone wrote elswhere, and i tought u ment the redrawing in the same sence as that person did.

        1. “redrawing the lines” was probably not the best choice of words. We actually meant doing so in your head. If you think social nudity is only possible in places where public sex is a real NO (like in every nudist place), you’ll have to redraw that thought if you want to be naked at a sensual resort.
          Sorry for the confusion but we’re certainly not advocating sex at nudist places.

          1. No its cool, im not saying it should be this or that way , i just understood it the way my reply sounded.

  6. OK so base level statements first. We’re not swingers and have no intention to start. We know people who are and we don’t care they are.

    We’re told, as is the case with nudists, that swingers come from all walks of life and levels of society and from what we’ve seen this appears to be true. So this would suggest that wherever you go you may well encounter, or unknowingly be associating with them, so for the most part they aren’t something to be feared yet, as Nick&Lins point out, many nudists see them as the Antichrist. Yet our experiences haven’t reflected this. We’ve stayed in two different ‘Adult’ or ‘Sensual’ venues. Have we been ‘approached’? Yes twice, but not at either of these venues or in fact any nudist venues. Both times it was in textile environments. I’m actually told there may have been a third time but my ability to read subtle messages is limited to those delivered in the form of a three story tall neon sign blaring Pink Floyd.

    So onto the venues. The first and probably the most infamous would be Cap d’Agde in the south of France. With its somewhat chequered history and well established facilities, not to mention the places sheer blind size it’s worth the visit to see it for yourself. While there are clubs catering to various tastes behaviour for the most part was reflective of societal norms. Obviously while there were places where more adult behaviour occurred you can easily avoid them. But the place really is a naked city. Oh and the clothes shopping there is fantastic. The fact that our favourite places to shop for clothing is nudist venues probably points to many layers of crazy that we don’t need to unpack here.

    The other place we stayed was Caliente in Pasco County, Florida. While this started as a nudist venue from the very start it had an adult feel to it. Again the place had great facilities restaurant, bars, gym, sauna and pools. We’ve stayed there a few times now and as we normally travel in a group the whole ‘not being spoken to’ wasn’t an issue for us. The other thing we liked in the place was the mirrored ceiling above the beds in the hotel rooms. Seriously, just because we don’t play with others doesn’t mean we don’t play with each other.

    There were two things both these places had in common firstly great facilities. Obviously just by its size Cap d’Agde wins hands down but Caliente was a full service resort. If you want to experience nudist living in upscale resorts these will do just that. The other thing was a younger clientele. I’ll leave it to you to try to workout what the reason is but as we’ve got kids in their thirties I think we’ve got it figured by simply talking to them.

  7. What a fantastic blog, well done for crossing that invisible line. I think there is a obviously a market for this type of holiday and I would like to think I have a live and let live sense of mind. I would go to sensual resort and like you I would not want to swing but just enjoy the luxury of the facilities for my own needs of just being naked around the pool area.

  8. I’m a “live and let live” kind of guy. If what you do doesn’t adversely affect me, then go ahead and enjoy yourself. Swingers who masquerade as nudists may claim that their activities are private and have no effect on other nudists, but I disagree. I want
    public nudity to be more widely accepted by society, but if society believes there is no difference between nudists and swingers, that will never happen, because promiscuous sexual activity is currently more unacceptable than public nudity. I believe this is the reason that organizations such as AANR and TNS maintain such high standards. Public perception is everything.

    1. Ya thats kinda what i said,but as i said .. unless ppl want also to create a new form of morality and standards ,and that would basicly mean, public sex is allowed anytime anywhere ,nudist or not nudist, .. so actually for that to happen, that wouldnt have anything to do with nudism but general new rules of morality ,and one thing would lead to an other, and who knows where it would end.

  9. Sometimes Nudist get too focused on separating sex and nudism. We need to acknowledge that having a sex life is normal, healthy and nothing to be ashamed of. And that is basically what swingers are about except that they are open to having sex with people they are not married to.

    The way we need to separate sex and nudism is just simply to educate the public that being a nudist does not mean we are doing it for sexual reasons. But we need to acknowledge that yes we do have sex lives.

    My wife and I were nudists long before we met each other and we met through the swinging lifestyle. But when we are at a nudist resort, no one even knows this because swingers can separate their sexual lifestyle from their nudist lifestyle. We even have run a little nudist group here for over 10 years and very few of them know we are swingers. I guarantee you that probably 20 to 40% of the nudists you hang out with at a Nudist resort have tried swinging, but they know how to keep it separate. Swingers are not killing the nudist image. But I do absolutely hate those who call themselves nudists when the only thing they talk about is sex, especially on websites. They are not nudists and those people do give us a bad name.

    The nudist lifestyle is supposed to be about accepting others just as they are. And if they are a swinger, but they treat you with respect then there should be no problem. And yes we need to acknowledge that swingers encompass every single aspect of the human lifestyle including gays, transgender, multiple religions, etc. We are a diverse crowd and should be proud of that.

    1. Its one thing to seperate the two , but the fact that u`ve said that 20-40% of nudies have tried or are swingers says enough that nudism and .. more sexual opennes is defo a thing, cause i doubt that 40% of non nudies have tried or are swingers.
      But im afraid that alots of ppl here are actually missing the point of this blog, i think N&L werent talking about if its ok or not, but to make it a new norm ..cause seperate venues already exist.

      1. Oh no, we certainly don’t want to make it a new norm! Separate venues do exist indeed, swingers are indeed sometimes frequenting nudist places and we wanted to figure out if this was possible the other way around as well, whether nudists can also frequent swingers places. Without becoming swingers themselves. Let’s compare it with soccer and say that we are Barcelona fans. Does that mean we can’t have fun at a Real Madrid game even though we don’t support that team? If we’re die hard fans and think that Real is the devil, we probably shouldn’t go to that stadium but other than that we will probably have a good time there.

        If we would start telling all the surrounding Real fans how Barcelona is so much better, we’ll probably get punched in the face. If we would have been telling the swingers at Desire about how wrong their lifestyle is, we would probably have been kicked out.

    2. Guy…..

      After 2 decades of nudist activities ranging from camping to 3,000 passenger cruises and finding more swinger activity in the non-nudist environment than at any nudist venue we’ve been to I’m left extremely curious as to the factual basis for you figgures of 20 – 40 %.

      Care to elucidate?

      1. Peter imma help him out .. i read on the ..umm.. young naturists of america or something like that, site, that est. 1/3 of naturists are swingers, so that coming from a naturist organization has a weights as an information in my book.
        On the other side, id like to ask u, what u ment by the swinger activity at in a non nudist environment?

        1. So there’s a bowl of fruit sitting on the kitchen bench in my house. Could you estimate what percentage of the fruit in this bowl is bananas? Of course not. What if I sent a photograph of said bowl of fruit, could you then estimate the percentage? Of course you can.

          Guy’s comment was very interesting in that he suggests that up to 40% of those in a nudist environment have tried swinging at some stage. From my experience this seems to be a very high figure. So let’s look at why there may be a disparity in our figures and I’ll happily start with mine.

          Firstly Kim and I are monogamous have always been and can’t see why this would ever change. We have made many friends with people we would have never met were it not for our involvement in social nudity. Given the controversial nature of the subject of swingers within the nudist community it’s an often discussed subject. During these discussions on the subject the overwhelming consensus was that what people did in private was nobody’s business but there’s, a live and let live philosophy if you will. These statements of acceptance were often prefaced with a comment like “while it’s not for us” or “I don’t think we’d ever do that” which I feel would indicate an expression of non-involvement in the swinging community.

          OK so let’s give my viewpoint on this a dose of reality shall we? It may well be that like minded people attract each other, after all nudists seem to form collectives, so is my perception of the numbers purley based on the fact that we hang out with like minded people? Could it also be that, as Guy says, “they know how to separate the two” and as a result we don’t ‘see’ them? Well yes that I’ll agree that could be the case as well.

          So given these things what additional evidence do I have to support my view that the numbers are low? Nude Cruises, well that and a bulletin board. We’ve done seven of these through BNTT and it should be emphasised that these are targeted at the clothing optional market and are not marketed as an ‘adult’ or ‘couples’ cruise. BNTT run a bulletin board for those going on the cruises and prior to two of the cruises some of those into swinging posted threads regarding meetups and ways to identify each other at the welcome aboard party. In looking at the activity on these threads, in what is a fairly anonymous forum, once you removed the posts making disparaging remarks about swingers the level of activity was fairly low suggesting the numbers attending was similarly low.

          So the above is how I came to a low estimate, it’s my “photograph of the fruit bowl” if you will.

          Now as to Guy’s figures, it would be wrong of me to suggest that I have a full knowledge of him or the collective experiences of his life. I will make no assumptions on how he arrived at his numbers other than those I have made against mine and base it only on what he has posted.

          Firstly Guy has identified as being a member of the swinging community. He also identifies as being a nudist. Now given the assumption used above that like minded people attract each other is it possible that this has occurred in Guy’s case? I would suggest that Guy would know more people in the swinger community than I ever will and so is it possible that the nudist group he and his partner ran had a membership that was biased due to these established relationships? This bias may well be amplified by, purely anecdotally speaking, the possibility that the number of swingers having issues with nudists may be lower than the number of nudists that have issues with swingers.

          This is simply meant to explain the differences I see between mine and Guy’s estimate of the numbers. Clearly I haven’t seen a photo of his bowl of fruit.

          Ok so on to your question: “what u ment by the swinger activity at in a non nudist environment?”

          Simple answer to this would be interaction with or knowledge of swingers or those who classify as being in ‘open’ relationships, I realise the two maybe considered different things. I believe we have been ‘sounded out’ by people who are swingers on two separate occasions. Kim believes it to be three but as anything more subtle than being plastered on a three story billboard blaring Pink Floyd and I’ll more than likely miss it. None of these occasions involved people we knew to be nudists or occured at nudist environments.

          Secondly of those we know that are swingers or in open relationships none to our knowledge identify as nudists.

          Final comment:
          This has been a great blog post. It’s got a lot of discussion happening from many perspectives without degenerating into name calling and insults. Not to bad for what can be at times a controversial subject.

          1. Sir,
            “So there’s a bowl of fruit sitting on the kitchen bench in my house. Could you estimate what percentage of the fruit in this bowl is bananas?”
            This is a guess ..
            But when a famouse nudist organization says that 1/3 of nudists are swingers, im pretty sure its not said just like that ,but with a research.
            I didnt say that, a nudist organization did.
            And just to note, im not a nudist.

            Secondly
            “onsensus was that what people did in private was nobody’s business but there’s, a live and let live philosophy if you will”
            A live and let live isnt a private thing, thats the whole point of it that it isnt private, thats why its called a live and let live ..

            Another think, ya it might be dumb to say but ill still say it ..about the , we know how to seperate the two .. well there are lots of criminals that have families, and they play with their kids,they love them and such .. so does that make a difference to what they are?

            And of course swingers will have less issues with nudies then the other way around, its always the more “perverted” that is more tolerant then the lesser one ,thats how things go .. thats why i always say that being “open minded” and “tolerant” is pure bullshit … every1 is, till their own borders .. anything over that is sick disgusting and so on..thats how ppl are.

          2. Yes it would be a guess. But if I sent a photo of the bowl you may see three bananas and seven other pieces of fruit. Without knowing the actual volume of the fruit in question you could estimate it at 39%.

            My point is an estimate is based on observations or other knowledge. That’s what I’m not seeing in the figgures.

            If a politician says “If you vote for my party I estimate your wages will increase by thirty percent in the first year” Would you simply assume it was correct and vote for them? Or would you want them to explain how?

    3. We completely follow your points about nudism and sex, trying to unlink one from the other has gotten way too far.

      But we can’t agree on the 20-40%. Although we can certainly believe that this is the case at some resorts, at others this will certainly not be so.
      We have a big problem with places that try to attract swingers but hide behind the name nudist/naturist. If a naturist goes there they can wrongly get the impression that half of the nudists are actually swingers. This is exactly the reason why we decided to do our little “test” at Desire, which promotes itself as a sensual place rather than a place that calls itself naturist but of which it’s commonly known that it’s frequented by swingers.

          1. It always is hahah, these kinda themes always have the most comments.
            But i always have this feeling that 9/10 ppl are not fully honest about things … almost like , checking the water if its hot enough..
            But thats the crazy thing of today .. we like live in a “free and democratic” world,(bullshit if u ask me, cause there aint no such thing nor there ever was) ,but yet many ppl are still afraid to say what they really wanna say cause they know it can cost them ,popularity, job, or even their freedom ,im talking about general stuff, not just this topic.

  10. Seeing comments here that suggest simple knowledge that these places exist, let alone gasp going to one, makes you complicit in the downfall of nudism as we know it and it’s simply not true! I’d also add it seems somewhat surprising to say the least.

    Why is this surprising? Well we constantly read that nudists are supposedly more intelligent or open minded than the rest of the population. Whether this has any foundation in actual research I’ve yet to discover but I will say that if someone has the ability to look at something like nudism objectively and see that there’s nothing inherently wrong about it, whether or not they choose to participate, takes a level of rational objectivity that it would seem many in the wider community do not possess.

    The other trait the we are often labeled with is that we are more accepting of others. Gotta say not feeling it here.

    Given Kim and I have been to these types of venues in the past simply for the nudity aspec you can understand why this is somewhat of a hot button for me given the assumptions and accusations are effectively being leveled at Kim and I.

  11. Good post.

    I definitely think a naturist can enjoy a sensual nude resort, but they can also hate it. It depends on how you define your own personal brand of naturism, what your expectations are, and the vibe of the resort during your stay.

    I’m not a swinger. Not my thing. But while I usually prefer a traditional family naturist type environment, I’m very open to a nude environment where rules are a bit looser. For me, it’s about truth in advertising. I don’t want to go somewhere expecting one environment and then find another.

    What appeals to me about the sensual resorts — more freedom and less judgement. If I have an erection, no one cares or wants me to run and hide. If I want to show some affection towards Mrs Naturistthoughts, that’s fine. Now, I’m not talking about having sex by the pool. Also, not my thing. But it’s appealing to be able to enjoy being nude together, the invigorating and exhilarating nature of it, without fear of offending another guest or running afoul of a rule or policy.

    Now if others were hitting on my wife and I, trying to get us into “the lifestyle”. I’d be out if there in a second. So, it depends. But I definitely think the possibility is there.

    1. Yes but heres a thing sir..
      About this last thing u wrote ..
      Nick`n`Lins wrote once about why do thextiles go to a nudist beach if they dont wanna be nude?!
      And they as i recall said that ,ya..really, why? Why do u wanna go there and not be nude unelss u wanna creep on nude ppl..?
      So why would a non swinger ,non public sex fan go to a swinger beach ,resotr or something like that , and not wanna mess around?
      I mean, thats exaclty what a swinger would say if there was to ask u, and u said no to them.
      I get that u said , u like that cause u can be more free and to be less judged..
      Does that mean then that clasic nudism is not freedom really? Cause thats all nudies say, that being a nudist means freeedom, and that nudies dont judge..
      I dont know, the more i read about all of this the more im confused, cause the word NATURist ,is like being a fan of natrual things, hence everything human is natrual ,in that sence nothing should be conisdered as offending ,cause natrual things cant be offending.
      And another thing, how would u explain to i dunno .. friends or family (kids) that you are going to a resort where its only for adults..? Specially knowing that you are not going there to do stuff ,but cause of what u described in ur post .. ?

      1. I think we already covered this off.

        Better facilities and we can be nude! That simple

        As you’ve admitted you’re not a nudist, and I’m assuming not a swinger either, you’d have lit or no real world experience in the subject which means you qualify as an audience member so your view that we went to these places because we want to be swingers is treated with the contempt it deserves.

        As to how we explain it to friends and family? We use our words. That simple, well in most cases it’s simple recent experiences excepted.

        1. Peter no offence, my post wasint aimed at you, that dont mean u cant reply to it of course..
          I`ve NEVER said that u went there cause ur a swinger,but even if i was, why would that offend u if u dont mind them?
          Yes im not a nudie nor a swinger nor i have exp natrually, but maybe that actually makes me see things better,cause im neutral? Ever tought about it that way?
          And well.. “we use our words to exlpain” ,isnt really an answer ,tho i as i said my Q wasnt for you.

          1. “So why would a non swinger ,non public sex fan go to a swinger beach ,resotr or something like that, and not wanna mess around?”

            We’re nudists who are “non swingers, non public sex fan” and your question is predicated on the assumption that the only reason a person goes to these venues is to “mess around”. So while you may well have not asked us you described us and attributed a reason for our actions that is simply not true. This is in spite of the fact the we and others have already explained our reasons.

            “I`ve NEVER said that u went there cause ur a swinger,but even if i was, why would that offend u if u dont mind them?”

            You do however feel that the only reason for going to these venues is to engage in swinger activities, refer your earlier question, which we have stated is not the case. It’s not being called a swinger that annoys me. It’s having actions attributed to Kim and I and others that are simply not true and despite explaining this it is rejected from a position based on zero experience points. Just because we’ve attended Weddings in Catholic churches doesn’t make us Catholic.

            As for you being able to “see things better” that is kind of like me claiming to be able to better resolve a referee’s dispute in the Irish game of Hurling because I’ve never seen the game, never played it and never read the rules. However that shouldn’t stop me from making a decision. I’ll go with the team whose jerseys are the nicest rather than seeking actual answers.

            “We use our words to explain” is a valid answer to how we tell our friends and family about these places. I would also add it’s exactly what Nick&Lins have done with this article and others have done in the comments. So yes we use our words. We talk to them, we email them, we leave a travel plan with them detailing where we’ll be and when we’ll be there and when we get back we tell them of the experiences we’ve had. All using our words, either written or spoken.

            Of course where this falls down is when you explain these things and they’re simply discounted completely because “I know what really went on there”. Thankfully people that know us, like say friends and family, don’t do that.

          2. This discussion seems to run a bit out of hand here, so let us try to explain it simple.
            A nudist/naturist is someone who likes to be naked without any sexual intentions.
            A swinger/lifestyler is someone who likes to switch partners with likeminded couples.
            A voyeur/exhibitionist is someone who gains sexual pleasure from seeing naked people or being seen naked.

            All three of these have a certain common ground: the nudity. And they can overlap. One can be a nudist and a swinger, a nudist and an exhibitionist, a nudist-exhibitionist-swinger, and so on.
            Those who are nudist/exhibitionist or nudist/exhibitionist/swinger are those you see having sex in public. At sensual resorts this is allowed, at nudist resorts they will be kicked out.
            Those who are nudist/swinger on the other hand, are accepted at nudist resorts as well as long as they keep the swinging indoors and don’t try to “recruit” other nudists.

            Because of the common love for nudity, all of them can thus visit the other’s places but whether or not their presence is accepted all depends of the rules of the place, their visions on their own lifestyle and about how (in)appropriate they behave.

            Does that make sense?

          3. Sorry Peter, you are constantly putting words in my mouth but ok, nm.

            No offence, but when one goes to a sensual resort, what the hell should be the first thing that comes to my mind?
            If i go to a football game, i can sleep all trough it cant i? But the a logical thinking would leed one to think that im actually going there to watch football? or not? …
            When i said i might see things better its cause im neutral, im not affected by whatever the hell is happening at any resort ,even if its something i dont even …wanna write that..
            Anyhow , as NnL said, its getting out of hand cause this turned to who said what ,not the subject.
            Once again, a sensual resort, is not a nudist resort.. just cause ppl are nude there that dont mean they are nudists/naturists.. im nude when im in the shower, that dont make me a nudist or even if im nude at home cause its too hot and i dont have an AC, that still dont make me a nudist.
            Of course ppl will be nude there cause why not?
            They are at a pool or beach, summer, they gonna have sex now or later .. whos gonna have sex with a scarf and gloves on a beach when its 50C on the sun at a sensual resort?..
            So back to my starting point, its getting confusing ,im not talking about who is what but about the venue,a sensual resort is not a nudist resort, if ur there as a nudist guest ,it dont really matter if ur naked or not, no1 will care anyway cause those ppl are even more open minded.
            I know all of this what NnL wrote here as a reply , but that wasnt really the subject ,not the way i understood it anyway ,cause all of those things are seperate things, and they already exist ,so theres no need to mention that.
            I tought originaly that the question was about puting nudism on a new level ,where sex wont be conisdered as something bad at any venue ,casue currently as things are, there are already different venues, so i tought that that isnt the subject.

            ps
            “Just because we’ve attended Weddings in Catholic churches doesn’t make us Catholic.”
            Very bad comparison .. u are invited as a guest there, and its not in ur hand if that church is catolic or orthodox …and ur there cause of the ppl that invited u , not cause of the church , whilst if ur going to a sensual resort, well.. that is ur choice.

  12. Yes Nick & Lins it does make sense thank you but what about the amorous Nudists? Those of us who just wish to be nude amongst others yet would like to be able to show our affections towards our significant others without the fear of judgement that we are kissing, caressing, lying on one another or perhaps even applying sunscreen on each other’s bodies without the need to “get a room!” As I have heard said one time too many to us or other couples who feel these actions are a natural, healthy form of expression and not a “sexual act” or a form of foreplay? Why should we have to hide how we feel because others may interpret it as provocative behaviour which solicits sneers from the staunch Naturists and advances from those who feel you’re advertising your interested in swinging?

    If I dance with my partner and a slow song comes on does that mean I can’t put my arms around her hold her tightly, dip her, twirl her around and yes even kiss her nice and slow without others finding that too much. If we were dressed in clothes provocative or not no one would really think twice about it but because we are naked it’s frowned upon! Where do lovers go to be naked and unafraid?

    1. Our advice is always: don’t do anything you wouldn’t do in a clothed social environment either. But we know that many resorts think differently and have strict rules when it comes to touching, kissing, etc. And we can’t really blame them, the line between appropriate and inappropriate behaviour becomes pretty small and it’t a hard job for them to identify the difference or to make sure that you have no “future plans” 🙂
      It takes only one rotten apple to ruin it for everyone.

      1. We understand your point and it’s true things can get out of hand with some folks and before you know it the devil rears his ugly head (so to speak) lol. But we are tired of going to places where we can’t be ourselves and have to hide our feelings for each other. Touching, holding, hugging, massaging and kissing each other are natural, caring acts of love and endearment meant to comfort, soothe and support one another. Not a prelude to sex in the next few minutes, like right there on the dance floor but something we may (or may not do) later in a more intimate, private setting where you are free to explore each other in that way.

        However! What we are so hoping to hear from you Nick & Lins is; In your extensive travels is there are anywhere in this World that you may know of where those like us who are in love and don’t want to hide it can feel comfortable to go and be naked?

        If you haven’t found any places like that yet please keep an eye out (again no pun intended) for the two of us or anybody else who may feel the same way.

        Our Clothing Optional Beach here on the Toronto Islands is a pretty tolerant place because it’s the only nude getaway for most of us “city dwellers” and people generally try to respect each others privacy even if it is just a few blankets away.

        I’m assuming some of the Nude beaches in Europe or around the world are the same but we would like to go to a place with overnight accommodations or perhaps be comfortable enough to stay for a week or so. Any help would be greatly appreciated and chillingly rewarded in the form of premium quality beer of the local variety lol…..Cheers!

        1. It really depends from place to place. The ones that strongly hold on to the traditional values are often the ones with the most rules. It’s better to search for places where the focus is rather on just being naked than on the connection with nature, the social factor, etc.
          Typically you’ll find these places rather in holiday destinations than in places with an established naturist history.
          For example you’ll find this more in the Caribbean than in Canada.

          1. Nice! That’s what I was thinking too. Thank you kindly! Would you recommend Zipolite to be one of those such places and/or destinations? From reading your review and what we have heard from a couple of others it sounds absolutely delightful and affordable;)..

      2. But its funny tho how ppl are ready to “draw a line” of whats inappropriate.
        Like to some, just one being a nudist and wanting to be nude with others or family is inappropriate ,sick or odd .. so to a someone like that, its sounds funny that kissing on a nudist resort would be considered as an offence while being nude in public isnt ..and generaly it is dumb ,regardless that the host can set any kind of rules they want ,but then again, whats the point then of saying that nudism is “freedom”?
        And speaking of thisssss ,heres an idea for a new blog for ya ..
        “What makes ppl be extremly close minded, or extremly liberal/open? ,and can one be in the middle (how would we call that? (liberaly-closeminded?) , and not be considered as a hypocite?

        I can already smell tons of comments on that one hah.

        1. Hey Iceman! The other day you said; “.. thats why i always say that being “open minded” and “tolerant” is pure bullshit … every1 is, till their own borders .. anything over that is sick disgusting and so on..thats how ppl are.”

          It kinda stuck in my head and the more I thought about the truer it seemed. We all have different standards on what’s acceptable behaviour I guess. But there’s nothing wrong with arguing your point or stance on the subject. Especially if it can make or break your Nudist experience or your way of (well I can’t say living because we wear clothes to work and in the City but) choosing to spend your free time.

          We’ve been in the Nudist?Naturist circles for over 10 years now and I don’t want it to end because we can’t find a common ground. We have made so many friends but just aren’t happy to hide how we want to be. So we just stay home and get naked. Alone! Just the two of us!…And that’s fine I guess. We venture out on occasion to an event but we want more and we’re willing to come out and talk about! In hopes it makes people aware and maybe willing to bend those “closed minds” a little to see things a little more our way ;)..

          Love your comments man! Keeps us on our toes and helps us see a non nudie’s (as you put it lol) perspective. Cheers!

          1. Hey Hi.

            Well,i like to say about my self that i dont speak what i think, i speak as it is. hah ,a little too smartassish from my side, but i really do think that.

            “We all have different standards on what’s acceptable behaviour ” ,thats true but lets not call it openminded or tolerant then , cause its not.
            And theres nothing wrong with not liking something,or even hating someting, but i just get pissed of when such ppl call them selfs open minded and tolerant just cause they are polititians or nudists, or they are porn actors (id have a great example from my perspective as why but i dont wanna say it .. touchy subject).
            And you know whats interesting? Even you two will judge someone ,and still consider ur selfs as openmimded ,hah sorry but thats the truth.

  13. Yes! Guilty as charged! But I try my damnedest to look at things from the other persons point of view and what I would do if I was in their shoes (or skin in this case) before even considering judging them. I really don’t like Judges, except for one, he’s a Nudist, very cool with an awesome Southern accent and charming as ever. My wife is an angel so she won’t say anything bad about anyone lol;)..

  14. Nudism/naturism changes all the time throughout the years. Having been nudists since college and owned or managed nudist resorts for 25 years, we have seen it or are aware of so many changes. In the 60’s many places where still “whites” only. In the 70’s, at most places you had to be married and with your husband if you went to a nude resort. In the 80’s and into the 90’s, only “swingers” shaved pubic hair or got non-military tattoos. In the 90’s and into the 2000’s many places wouldn’t allow piercings except for ears. Genital jewelry was frowned upon until the 2010’s and is still frowned upon at many places.
    In 1995 we “dared” to say in print that nudism was fun and received holy hell from a naturist organization insisting that if continued to openly say nudism was fun, governments all over the US would shut down the nudist movement. In their mind only “swingers” said nudism was fun.
    We’ve always operated our resorts with full disclosure. We do not want to mislead people.
    IMO, that is how places should operate. You can’t be all things to all people, all the time. Decide on how to operate you place and let people know.

    1. Exactly, the big mistake many resorts are making these days is trying to aim for all “types” of nudists. Which leaves them somewhat in the middle where nobody’s really happy. Instead they should be focusing on the audience they want to service and adjust to their needs.
      But we don’t have to tell you how to run a successful business 🙂

      1. Well maybe those type of resorts are trully the open minded hah, like i said the new moral kinda thing where .. “its a nudie beach/resort/camp/whatever but you might see stuff going on, but at same time we wont restrict anyone from being here”.
        But for real , i doubt they are afraid to say if they are this way or that way ,cause there are tons that do that, so its not a secret, so maybe they really wanna make someting newer, combining the two.

  15. I haven’t seen it all as I’m not old enough to have seen things in the 60’s, and 70’s, but from talking with other nudist resort owners I know about the the early operations. I’d say my favorite time is now. Times are more liberal in parts of the US like California where we are located in Palm Springs.
    What has also always surprised me is how many “nudists/naturists” feel that “their” way is the only way to enjoy nudism. Most of the time it is guys telling women what they “must” do to be a “true” nudist.

    1. Oh i misunderstood u , u said u were managed resorts for 25 years and u mentioned the 60s and so on ,so i kinda ment that u had a resort/camp from about that time.
      Having said that u didnt see those times, how would u know that now is the best time? lol.
      ANd what u mean that times are more liberal?
      I dunno really , but id say that its the oposite actually ,specially in USA, where as soon as one gets naked , he`s ,and yes i say HE`s (no1 will ever say that for a female right? ) labeled as a predator-pervert, thats whay i see from media all the time..and thats kind of hypocrisy considering that we are bombarded with nakedness and sex on social media,in the so called music of today , and such ..
      Nick wrote about how todays kids shower with underpants on after gym or something like that, whilst i also read that like back in the days ,40-50-60s.. something like that, in the USA when they was swimming class or something like that where the schools participated, every1 was swimming naked.
      From what i know by reading stuff, id say there was no more liberal times then the 70s.

  16. Now is the best of times as nudists around the world travel for new experiences. Plus, I’m not that old to have owned a resort in the 1960’s, LOL. For us it’s fun meeting guests from all continents except Antarctica.
    Times are more liberal in that there is not a big stigma in saying you’re a nudist. We’ve been featured in the LA Times newspaper as the feature travel destination of Palm Springs. We’ve been on TV all over the US, Canada, mexico, Chile, BBC, France, Germany and more. That never would have happened before the late 1990’s. I really think we’re one of the major reasons nudism has taken off as we have always operated mainstream.
    I’m from Chicago, and we went to the YMCA and boys and men swam nude.
    True, there is a difference between nudity with couples vs single men. But, it has always been that way.

    1. Actually, how big of an accomplishment would that be? having guests from Antartica. They probably aren’t really used to take their clothes off 😀

      1. I’d add that BNTT was planning a nude cruise to Antartica a few years back. Sadly it didn’t eventuate but had it hit the books we’d have been there. Spectacular scenery, wildlife and nudists. What more could you want?

    2. Well Tom u cant be young forever so no need to run away from that hahah.
      I dont know ,you are from USA , maybe its or was different there compared to Europe, maybe Nick and Lins can say more about that ..
      As for being in media, well lets face it, internet and now specially phones and apps ,made everything to be instant .. i mean u can actually broadcast to the world to see whatever u want them to see.. u couldnt do that not that long ago, so it makes sence that u were more on TV now compared to as it was back them cause they have no need to hide anything now considering the internet and the phones will do it instead of them,so if they wanna be up to date and relevant, they have to do anything that the internet does, hence it has not much to do with nudism or anything liek that but more about the views and to still be relevant as a corporation.
      I dunno about nudism but here where i live we had at least 1 nudist movie made in the 80s ,and ive seen tons of European movies with nudeness or nudism , and ghm.. some more in it in some movies ,and im talking about regular movies not xxx.
      So mostly thanx to internet and phones yes, its way easier today to see something naked to promote ur resort, or anything that has to do with it, but i would thank that to technology, rather then thinking that ppl are more liberal today.. they arent, they just have a way to show what then couldnt be seen cause of the lack of techology.
      Tho i still think that the tech brought more to the sex side of nudeness then to nudeness it self.

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